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Where is all this in the Fathers? This no-popery theology is pretty elaborate...surely it is in there somewhere?

Where does it stop? If the Holy Father lost his primacy, however it is defined, and it was transfered to Constantinople...what do you say about Moscow being the "Third Rome?" And if Moscow's no longer fit, what is it then, the ROAC? Where does it stop? Who decided these things if not Rome? 1500...

I think the examples you offer are red herrings, Joe. St. Patrick didn't intervene in matters of other churches...St. Gregory didn't say the Pope does not have primacy of jurisdiction. Your post doesn't answer why time after time, the east looked to Rome for "clarifications."

When is the phrase "First among Equals" first used to describe the Pope?

I did reread them. I am still left wondering...what was the concensus among western fathers? St. Clement, the third Pope, intervened, showing primacy of jurisdiction, in his Epistle to the Corinthians. ~80AD Please pardon my anti-Orthodox tone. I have simply witnessed too much EOx arrogance...

Rome was not the only western Church founded by the apostles. Tradition tells the same of England and Spain. (St. Paul.) I have a question for Orthodox on this board, and I present it with humility and respect. If the Eastern Orthodox Church is infallible, why did EOx bishops look to Rome to...

Linus, et al, is this the best Orthodoxy has to offer? What on earth could anything anybody said here make me want to make the swim!? Think about what you write. Think about how things looks to outsiders. Wash the cup, inside and out. All I have seen here is more internet intransigence. I...

IIRC 1999, but it is a moot point. He still had the Chaldeans to think of. I am not an expert on Islamic culture, but I have a friend from Iraq. (Chaldean by culture). I will ask him what he makes of this.

This is quickly degenerating into a Catholic vs. Orthodox rant. Let's just be Christian and emphasize what we have in common for a while...like Saints, Fathers, the Eucharist, and Tradition.

Rome is not under an islamic regime, but remember, the Pope did this when visiting Saddam's Iraq, whose minority Chaldeans were most definitely persecuted. Nobody here has a right to judge. Who knows what would have happened if the Pope mistepped with the Iraqi Muslims?

I am starting to accept that the event happened and was covered by the news. I am also starting to think it has been blown out of proportion. If I were in an Orthodox Cathedral, I would try to be culturally sensitive. I think it is the same here. Christians are slowly entering dhimmitude in...

Please pray for me, for a personal struggle I am going through. I'll take Jesus prayers, Akathists, Rosaries, or whatever you got. You can even pray for my conversion, (but know that my prayer is for non-canonical conversion.)

BTW: Practically every site I saw with a picture of the Pope kissing the koran was fruitcake and not worthy of close perusal, by Orthodox or Catholic. I wonder if the Holy Father was just throwing a bone to anti-Catholics, to give our apologists something to do for a living. (Just kidding, but...

When I was non-Catholic, I still called priests, "Father." This was a sign of respect and not an assent of faith. I think the situation here is analogous.

BTW, I did a search for "Kisses Koran," and this is the first site that came up: http://www.remnantofgod.org/1wc.htm FRUITCAKE! I am unshaken in my faith in the RCC. Rome hasn't made ex cathedra statements on the equal efficacy of Islam and Christianity, and won't. Moreover, I haven't had a...

What about love of enemies? What about all the martyrs that have died among Christians at the hands of Christians? How are we going to move beyond that? I am not saying it was a wise move, and I am not advocating an appeasement policy. But I think peace among religions is a desirable thing, and...

Well, I think the articles explain it pretty well...it was a sign of respect for Islam and an act of sympathy for the suffering Iraqi people. I can live with that :)

Also, how do we know he is kissing it? It is really not that revealing of a picture.

Furthermore, how do we know this isn't an example of Adobe Photoshop magic?

First off, how do we know it's a koran? Second off, how do we know the arab in the picture is a muslim? (There are arab Christians.) Second off, seeing as how Arabic probably is not one of the Holy Father's 17 languages, how do we know he knew these things?