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A question for protestants...

Rafa999

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Poor Alveus, annoy him when he is right. It is absolutely not fair to say that a Hierarch of the OC, RCC, or my church such as the deceased Mar Benyamin Shimun:




is doing a poorer job at preserving the teachings of the apostles then these guys  ;D:







 

Rosehip

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Now, I see that as rather unfair, Rafa. There are many humble, sober Protestants who are nothing like Benny Hinn etc. It is unfair to lump everyone together. I certainly don't connect David with those three photos at the bottom of your post, and I'm experienced enough to know that there are MANY sober Evangelicals who would want nothing to do with that brand of Christianity.
 

Melodist

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Rafa999 said:
I can't believe I missed it.

Rosehip said:
Now, I see that as rather unfair, Rafa. There are many humble, sober Protestants who are nothing like Benny Hinn etc. It is unfair to lump everyone together. I certainly don't connect David with those three photos at the bottom of your post, and I'm experienced enough to know that there are MANY sober Evangelicals who would want nothing to do with that brand of Christianity.
I know plenty of protestants who reject all those TV "evangelists" and the "gospel" they offer. Unfortunately, that is the message that is being spread using media and apparently is popular enough for people to keep funding it.
 

Alveus Lacuna

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What is wrong with everybody?!?! The comment was obviously sarcastic!  Christ says to love your enemies, if I even considered him one, which I don't!  Gosh!
 

dllwatkins

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David Young said:
But detaching the NT from Holy Tradition, I do think that our understanding of the words and roles form a coherent and consistent whole.

I am not saying that your claim to unbroken historical succession of bishops is false (though neither do I see it as proven). What I have said is, that it is not in our view a biblical concept, and thus even if it is a historical fact, it has no spiritual importance.
I think this underscores an important difference in perspectives.  Our Faith is not derived from the Bible as if we found this book and started the Christian Faith.  You can't detach it from Holy Tradition, it is a part of it and comes out of it.  We don't form concepts from it as a religious text in and of itself.  It does, in fact, have an historical and religious context.  In this connection, I would recommend the following article as very pertinent to this discussion:
http://orthodoxinfo.com/general/Saint-Hilarion-Holy-Scripture-and-the-Church.pdf
 

FatherGiryus

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Alveus Lacuna said:
What is wrong with everybody?!?! The comment was obviously sarcastic!  Christ says to love your enemies, if I even considered him one, which I don't!  Gosh!
Dear Alveus,

As a rule, I never underestimate my ability to confuse people... or be confused.

Obviously it was 'sarcastic,' but the intent behind your sarcasm is less than obvious given the responses.  There isn't anything wrong with the folks here, they are just doing what humans do best: they read what they want to read rather than your intentions.

This is one of the drawbacks of internet communication: people don't "know" you and they certainly can't see the expressions on your face as you type.  That's why, to prevent misreadings, your sarcasm would best serve you by providing your own 'decoder ring,' be it a smiley or a simple explanation.

Frankly, I took your sarcasm to mean that you thought we were beating David up unfairly and then were high-fiving each other afterwards.  That's why I responded the way I did.  That's what is 'wrong with me.' ;)

Anyway, in my old age I have discovered that my own sense of humor is generally inaccessible to others, which is why I tend to share it less and less as I get on in years.  Most of my problems have come from trying to be smart or funny.  Now I see what great liabilities those efforts have been.

 

Rafa999

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ialmisry said:
Melodist said:
Rafa999 said:
I can't believe I missed it.
I'm REAL sorry I missed it: the date is the exact day I met my exwife.  Scotty, beam me up.

How do they calculate these dates?
More on the rapture, here's a rapture video game which is selling amongst evangelicals:


http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/leftbehindeternalforces/video/6130072
(trailer)

http://www.eternalforces.com/




Not much is known about this mysterious leader of the Enigma Babylon One World Faith. All that is known is that he had absolutely no religious background, training or belief before the disappearances. The disappearances brought chaos to the world and Carpathia needed someone to promote a One World Religion. The Enigma Leader had no religious background, but was an excellent public speaker. He quickly told people that religions had caused divisions and bloodshed and under the GC banner they would strive to see God in each person. The religion quickly found acceptance around the world just as Carpathia predicted. His efforts for unity among religions hit one snag, however. Christians who still contended Jesus Christ had returned to take his own were enemies of the One World Religion.  
The new one Ive seen amongst Baptists is very disturbing to me...they have adopted the JW apologetic that Christ did not die on a Cross (which is "pagan") but on a "torture stake" instead:



For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: whose end is destruction, whose god is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame—who set their mind on earthly things
Philippians 3:18-19
 

Rafa999

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Its a real video game  ;D

You play as one of the people "left behind" from the rapture, and you build little tank things to combat antichrist peacekeepers, muslims, and catholics/orthodox. The orthodox and catholics become little evil spirit things which attack your player. All orthodox are under the "Enigma one mystery babylon" religion (a thinly veiled pope I showed). Baptist pastors have superpowers and launch little rays from their mouths to kill demons.

Here is a pic of a "lost soul" which the orthodox and catholics turn into if they don't become evangelicals:



 

GreekChef

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Wow, all I was doing was expressing my disappointment that David had gone away and the conversation had stopped. It certainly wasn't meant as triumphalism. It certainly wasn't meant to cause such a flurry of posts! Now I'm embarrased! But, I think David knows he is my friend. I am confident in that. I, too, will wait and pray that he is well.

And Rafa, as David is my friend and a sincere Christian man, and seeing as how it's Lent and we're supposed to be more charitable, Lets not associate him with all of those charicatures and stereotypes that you posted, eh? For those of us that have been talking to David for over a year now, we can certainly vouch that he isn't one...
 
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Papist said:
Which enemy? I thought David was a friend of all here, whether Orthodox or not. If anything, he should be in everyone's prayers out of love. I certainly do NOT consider myself your enemy simply because I am not Eastern Orthodox.
Amen!
 

FatherGiryus

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Rafa999 said:
The new one Ive seen amongst Baptists is very disturbing to me...they have adopted the JW apologetic that Christ did not die on a Cross (which is "pagan") but on a "torture stake" instead:
In Orthodoxy, we die to the flesh on the "Torture Steak" during Lent... at least the smell of it!  ;)
 

David Young

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I've been away in Tewkesbury for a few days off with my wife. Tomorrow, I go away for a few days with my work. There have been so many posts and questions that I probably shall never answer them now, but I dare say the same points will arise again in discussion between us. Even so, you may have asked questions (I forget now what they all were!) to which I do not know an answer. In fact, I distrust religious people who have all the answers to all questions. It seems to reduce God and take the mystery out of worshipping him and walking with him.
 

ialmisry

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David Young said:
I've been away in Tewkesbury for a few days off with my wife. Tomorrow, I go away for a few days with my work. There have been so many posts and questions that I probably shall never answer them now, but I dare say the same points will arise again in discussion between us. Even so, you may have asked questions (I forget now what they all were!) to which I do not know an answer. In fact, I distrust religious people who have all the answers to all questions. It seems to reduce God and take the mystery out of worshipping him and walking with him.
Glad to see you check in.
 

Rafa999

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David I was only joking. Of course you are not like those guys I posted, everybody here knows that. I'd be careful though, a little leaven leavens the whole lump. Also glad to see you check in, and where is Cleopas?
 

deuteros

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Christianus said:
Whatever happened to the Greek speaking churches in Antioch, Greece, Jerusalem, and in Alexandria?
most protestants can't answer me on this, the best answer I can get is orthodoxy.
My guess is that they would say they were destroyed by the Muslims.
 

Marc1152

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David Young said:
I've been away in Tewkesbury for a few days off with my wife. Tomorrow, I go away for a few days with my work. There have been so many posts and questions that I probably shall never answer them now, but I dare say the same points will arise again in discussion between us. Even so, you may have asked questions (I forget now what they all were!) to which I do not know an answer. In fact, I distrust religious people who have all the answers to all questions. It seems to reduce God and take the mystery out of worshipping him and walking with him.
Just a suggestion. Perhaps you can ask a few questions of us to re-boot the conversation.
 

ytterbiumanalyst

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rakovsky said:
ialmisry said:
LOL. We don't get much British understatement here usually.
What does British understatement mean?
British cultural speech patterns seem to have a propensity toward understatement; that is, the intentional use of euphemism and other verbal devices to make a statement with the least possible offence. For example, whereas an American might say, "That is the ugliest man I've ever seen," a British person might say, "That man has a face one simply cannot forget." For this reason, American speech can sometimes appear to the rest of the world to be brash, whereas British parlance can appear elusive and incomprehensible.
 

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Christianus said:
Whatever happened to the Greek speaking churches in Antioch, Greece, Jerusalem, and in Alexandria?
most protestants can't answer me on this, the best answer I can get is orthodoxy.
Having watched this sit here for a long time, I have to ask this: why does anyone have to have an answer to what "happened" to them? What is there that has to be explained by some happening?
 

rakovsky

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Keble said:
Christianus said:
Whatever happened to the Greek speaking churches in Antioch, Greece, Jerusalem, and in Alexandria?
most protestants can't answer me on this, the best answer I can get is orthodoxy.
Having watched this sit here for a long time, I have to ask this: why does anyone have to have an answer to what "happened" to them? What is there that has to be explained by some happening?
:)
 

Tzimis

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Keble said:
Christianus said:
Whatever happened to the Greek speaking churches in Antioch, Greece, Jerusalem, and in Alexandria?
most protestants can't answer me on this, the best answer I can get is orthodoxy.
Having watched this sit here for a long time, I have to ask this: why does anyone have to have an answer to what "happened" to them? What is there that has to be explained by some happening?
I guess you have never read Aristotle either. The premise is based on "What ever has motion has cause". ;)
 

Keble

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Demetrios G. said:
Keble said:
Having watched this sit here for a long time, I have to ask this: why does anyone have to have an answer to what "happened" to them? What is there that has to be explained by some happening?
I guess you have never read Aristotle either. The premise is based on "What ever has motion has cause". ;)
Well, quantum mechanics took causality down a notch quite some years ago, but I still don't see anything here that I, as a Protestant, should be expected to have an explanation for.
 

Fr. George

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Alveus Lacuna said:
I won't take this thread anymore off track talking about my lineage, I just have to share that I found an amazing website that tracks my lineage all the way back to AD 555.  I am the descendant of many French kings!  Unbelievable!
What website is this?
 

JamesR

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ignatius said:
I think the claim that Protestants make is that the 'real' Church is a Spiritual 'people' and not a 'holy' Institutional/National entity like Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy.
I think there are two issues with that premise. Firstly, the two are not mutually exclusive. The spiritual people ARE those who belong to the Church. We know this because the Spirit--in St. Paul's own words--would lead to UNITY (1 Cor 1:10)--not into disorder like Protestantism. And thus, if there is order, then there should be a visible body of believers, and we would thus argue that that visible body of believers IS the Orthodox Church. Secondly, they are assuming that the RC and EO Churches are merely "institutions" when we would say that it is the visible body of Christ on Earth. Protestants generally have a really bad understanding of EO/RC ecclessiology.
 
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