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Blasphemous and Heretical Musings of a Self-Styled Deity Claiming Unity of Belief Between Christianity and Hinduism

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dattaswami

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Agia Marina said:
Jim Jones was your guru, wasn't he?

God is my guru.If some body claim as Human form of GOd, then his knowledge should be analysed to find out whether he is real human form of God or not. One should be patient enough to analyse the knowledge preached by the person who claim to be human form of God. This is very much needed other wise any bad person can come and mislead you telling that he is God. Such exploitation should be prevented. Anyway God will certainly punish the people who mislead the innocent devotees. It is better anbody not  to falsely assume as human incarnation and mislead innocent devotees. If any body mislead innocent devotees then God will not spare such people. God is very alter and efficient and He sees His children get the right divine knowledge by coming in human form. He gives the identification mark to identify Him when He comes in human form.

Special knowledge is only an identification mark of the human body into which God entered. The possessor of excess of any quality is mentioned by that quality itself. Hence, the special knowledge means the possessor of it and it stands as the identity mark of the possessor.The above Vedic statement does not mean that the special spiritual knowledge itself is God.

It is only an identification mark of the human body into which God entered. The possessor of any quality in excess can be denoted by the very quality itself as per Sanskrit grammar, which is the personification of the quality. For example, it is said that no age shall be seen in the case of potency (tejasam hi na vayah…). Here the potency itself has no age. Here potency means the possessor of the potency personified. Similarly, the word Prajnanam means the possessor of Prajnanam, through personification. Hence it means that the possessor of exceptional spiritual knowledge is God.
 

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dattaswami said:
You have read the Bible and concluded that the Speaker of the Bible should be God.  The Author of the Bible might have taken the wine of grapes or might have taken the non-vegetarian dish.  You may search for the reasons of such specific behavior of the incarnation.  But your faith on Him as God should not be disturbed if you have not got the answer in your analysis.  You may find out the reason for the smoking of gold medalist.  But you should not keep the gold medal in suspension till you find out the reason.  
The vegetarian reason suspended the specific grape. Your medal of behavior reasons till the Author got his analysis. Your disturbed wine may search for a smoking incarnation. Suspension might have taken a non-vegetarian faith.
 

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dattaswami said:
Agia Marina said:
Jim Jones was your guru, wasn't he?
The  true and excellent spiritual knowledge alone is the deciding factor because you are going to get the right direction in your spiritual journey through the true knowledge only.   Therefore, you have to recognize God through such correct advice which is called as true spiritual knowledge.  After recognition, you should not analyze the other aspects of God.  After giving highest marks to the answer script, you should give the gold medal to the writer.  You should not stop the gold medal since the student is smoking.

You have read the Bible and concluded that the Speaker of the Bible should be God.  The Author of the Bible might have taken the wine of grapes or might have taken the non-vegetarian dish.  You may search for the reasons of such specific behavior of the incarnation.  But your faith on Him as God should not be disturbed if you have not got the answer in your analysis.  You may find out the reason for the smoking of gold medalist.  But you should not keep the gold medal in suspension till you find out the reason.  

Whether you find out the reason or not the gold medalist is a gold medalist. Therefore, it is the climax of the foolishness of the ignorance to decide some person as God first and then believe his knowledge as the true knowledge.  You have to impartially examine the knowledge of various preachers and the best selected knowledge must lead you to its author as God.  Such God  may belong to your caste or not, may belong to your religion or not, may belong to your nation or not since God is always universal and His preaching is also universal since He is the creator of the entire humanity.  Gita also says that the Preacher of the true knowledge is God (Jnanitvaatmaiva….).  This means that the merit of the knowledge alone should be the deciding factor in recognizing God.  
I asked a "yes" or "no" question.  And, you're incapable of responding.    

You're fascinated by shiny objects, aren't you?  Focus, focus...!!  
 

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dattaswami said:
If some body claim as Human form of GOd, then his knowledge should be analysed to find out whether he is real human form of God or not.
Ok give me some divine knowledge to analyze. How about this for starters. What's my favorite kind of food?
 

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[quote author=Agia Marina I don't have to worry about mocking you.  Whew!  That's a relief! [/quote]
[/quote]




Correct you need not worry. But you are loosing the golden chance of serving GOD directly. If you do not accept God in human form, He is not going to loose anything. If you neglect and insult Him also He is not going to loose anything! God is kind and He want His foolish children to get uplifted by the right divine knowledge. I am not telling that you are the only person who reject God in human form, majority are like this. God is coming in every generation from the beginning of creation for preaching the knowledge. For Him this insult and rejection is not a new experience. It is like this for all these generations, when He comes no body recognise Him other than a very very few real devotees.

Hence God also do not care when insulted here, because this is been happening for generations together. Still kind GOd comes in human form. He always see the betterment of His people. God is a kind father. His actions are always unselfish and hence He is not bothered about insult here. After all this entire creation is only a dream for Him. And insult is only a part of the dream hence He enjoys it very well.


Human form of God is the correct place of God.God is not answering to us from heaven. The correct place is the human incarnation, He is the church or temple in which God lives and is a pious place, since God is present in the human body of the human incarnation. Direct service to such human form of God is the direct service to God. Presence of God is indicated by the knowledge preached by such human form of God. Only practical service alone can please God. A service become practical when it is directly received by the person to whom the service is done. God present in the human form of God, receives your service when you serve such Human form of God. Here service means participating in the mission of divine knowledge propagation of the GOd in human form without any selfish desire.

Such path is a royal path and is most liked by God.


When Jesus came to this world, there were priests and churches. But His disciples approached Jesus only, since they know that GOd is present in human incarnation (Jesus). God is not present in statues of churches or temples. God is present in human incarnation alive. This is also proved when Jesus went to the church and opened the scripture for reading. He read: The God is in Me, for preaching the divine knoweldge to all those who crave for it.......

Dear Agia Marina !! Why are you not understanding these concepts!!! Wake up analyse the divine knowledge, if you are not following it in practical, atleast understand it theoretically so that atleast in the future generation you may be able to recognise Him when He comes to you in human form............
 

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This is all very sad.  This man is possessed by demonic forces and we taunt him!!!!!  This man, if not delivered from this, will reap *eternal* destruction.  Shouldn't such a thought make us sick, make us break down in tears!?  Just the thought of dattawami, beloved of God, facing eternal destruction, makes me want to scream.  Instead we laugh at him.  Do we lack such faith?  Do we truly believe in the devil and eternal darkness?  Do we believe in the God that can deliver him?  We must, must, must pray for him. Lord have mercy!
 

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Ortho_cat said:
dattaswami said:
If some body claim as Human form of GOd, then his knowledge should be analysed to find out whether he is real human form of God or not.
Ok give me some divine knowledge to analyze. How about this for starters. What's my favorite kind of food?

God has not come for forecasting about worldly habits etc which are irrelevant. For such aspects you can visit an astrologer. Jesus was tied on the eyes by a peice of cloth and soldiers beat and spit on His face and asked Jesus: If you are God then tell us, who beat you!! This was the tendency of ordinary ignorant people. They think that God is power only. They never know that God is the possessor of excellent divine knowledge.

You should not embarrass God by foolish statements even though they are true

 Govindabhagavatpada, the preacher of Shankara jumped from the top of hill announcing that if God is the author of Veda, he will be protected.  He was protected because his statement was from God.  If every fellow utters this and jumps from hill, he will die since the statement is from the devotee and not from God, even though the statement is true.  You should not embarrass God by such foolish statements even though they are true.  If God states through you, He will certainly act through miracle.  You are the best judge of the source of your statement since your inner consciousness knows the truth very well.  If the statement is from God, you will utter it forcibly and spontaneously.

Satan challenged Jesus to turn the stones into breads by the grace of God if God is really omnipotent.  Really God is omnipotent and God can turn the stones into breads in no time.  But Satan provoked Jesus to do the miracle and God is not involved in this issue directly.  Jesus replied to Satan stating that one should not test God through miracles.  Jesus did several miracles to change several human beings in to devotees. When the devotee deserves the miracle, it was done spontaneously.  Satan doesn’t deserve the miracle and God does not wish to do the miracle for the sake of Satan.  Jesus grasped the will of God and did not force God to do the miracle.  Even if He forces God will not do the miracle.  He acted as a devotee to preach this point to devotees.
 

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Ionnis said:
This is all very sad.  This man is possessed by demonic forces and we taunt him!!!!!  This man, if not delivered from this, will reap *eternal* destruction.  Shouldn't such a thought make us sick, make us break down in tears!?  Just the thought of dattawami, beloved of God, facing eternal destruction, makes me want to scream.  Instead we laugh at him.  Do we lack such faith?  Do we truly believe in the devil and eternal darkness?  Do we believe in the God that can deliver him?  We must, must, must pray for him. Lord have mercy!
You need not recommend anybody to God! When you ask some thing in present or some thing in the future, it clearly means that you are reminding Him about the corresponding reaction that is to be immediately implemented in the need.  This indirectly means that God is not alert as you are.  This is insulting God.  Due to such sin the requirement is not answered.  If you are asking to protect yourself or somebody else, it indirectly means that He is not aware of the things to be done due to the irresponsibility and this also indicates that He is not as kind as yourself.

It means that God has potency to help but not kind enough to render the help.  On contrary, it also means that you lack unfortunately the potency.  It means if you fortunately have the potency you could have immediately responded and helped.  Therefore, when ever you ask for anything it clearly means indirectly that God has some type of defect, which does not exist in your case.  When you ask Him to fulfill the desire it looks as if that your desire is constitutionally justified.  But God is not positively reacting due to either lack of positive response immediately or due to lack of knowledge of the constitution or due to lack of kindness to help the needy.  All these points are very very subtle.  But God is the most subtle and therefore, the knowledge of this analysis will certainly restrict you from asking any fulfillment of your desire. 
 

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Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
 

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Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)

Thank you for your concern about me and prayer for me!!

People think that others need prayer and they are already pleased God by that! They do not think about themselves but about others all the time! They think that they are very much beloved of God and others are not, hence others need their prayer for their upliftment!!

The human form of the Lord faces many problems during His stay in this world.


Jesus was boycotted and was even crucified by the priests based on the same reasons of economy and fame. They feared that Jesus will become famous and the donations may go only to Jesus. They could not find fault with His divine knowledge (Bible). They have found irrelevant silly reasons to boycott Him. Jesus told that He will destroy the church and raise it in three days. He meant His body when He said church because when He uttered this statement, He was pointing to His body. The priests just repeated the statement without referring to the finger-indication. Based on this irrelevant point, He was boycotted and crucified.

Certain people in some regions had boycotted Him in certain times but now in all the regions, all the people including the priests respect Him so much! Therefore the human form of the Lord faces such problems during His stay in this world.


www.universal-spirituality.org
Universal Spirituality for World Peace
 

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Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
Jesus told to all those people who were crying: Why are you crying for Me? You cry for yourself for your future not for Me!

Like wise stop praying for Me, pray for your spiritual uplifment and put effort to please God by practically serving God in human form.....
 

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theistgal said:
Just out of curiosity - assuming you are God, how exactly do you want us to treat you?
He does not expect anything from anybody. Only, you  have to decide. If you do something according to the expectation of God then you will aspire for some result. ‘Oh! I have done according to Your expectation then what is the fruit for this’. Such idea comes. Suppose you do something without any expectation from God by yourself; then you cannot expect anything in return for your service. If you expect something, God will say, ‘did I ask you to do this? I never asked to do this’. Suppose you have done something by yourself. You have participated in the mission by yourself.

You have done some service without the expectation of God, then you cannot ask God for some result. Suppose God expects you to participate in the service and you have participated. Then there is a chance to ask God for some result. The disciple may argue like you expected something from me and I fulfilled it; then protect me and do something to me. Such tendency may develop.

There is atleast a chance to ask like that. So, one should participate in the mission of God without any expectation from God. He should not bother about the expectation of the God. He should do the service to God by himself and by his own interest. When he does by himself, never in his mind will he get any aspiration or result from God. That is the best process.
 

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dattaswami said:
[quote author=Agia Marina] I don't have to worry about mocking you.  Whew!  That's a relief!
Dear Agia Marina !! Why are you not understanding these concepts!!! Wake up analyse the divine knowledge, if you are not following it in practical, atleast understand it theoretically so that atleast in the future generation you may be able to recognise Him when He comes to you in human form............
[/quote]Does he look anything like these guys?

(Courtesy of bogdan, the Artiste! ;D)
 

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Agia Marina said:
dattaswami said:
[quote author=Agia Marina] I don't have to worry about mocking you.  Whew!  That's a relief!
Dear Agia Marina !! Why are you not understanding these concepts!!! Wake up analyse the divine knowledge, if you are not following it in practical, atleast understand it theoretically so that atleast in the future generation you may be able to recognise Him when He comes to you in human form............
Does he look anything like these guys?

(Courtesy of bogdan, the Artiste! ;D)
[/quote]

You have to analyse the divine knowledge, not the apperance or outer body of the human incarnation. What one will get by analysing the body? He may come in any body He likes, what is great in the appearence of human body. After all the human body in which GOd exists is going to be perished. Human body is not the indication of God. Divine knoweldge coming from the mouth of human incarnation is the indication of God. Human body is only a medium in which GOD exists in the human incarnation. The human form has mouth, ear, eyes ... so that God can speaks to us through the mouth of the human form of God. The knowledge is the main identity mark not the human body.

However, the body of the human incarnation in which the God-charged soul exists is called as kshetram (pious), which is the sacred place of the temple of God in which God exist . Hence, the bodies of the ordinary human beings are called by the word shariram.  The same body and the same soul exist in human incarnation also.  But since God exists in the soul of human incarnation, the body of human incarnation is called as Kshetram

 Even though, the same body and the same soul exist in other human beings also, those bodies are not called as Kshetram, since God does not exist in those souls.
 

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dattaswami said:
Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
Jesus told to all those people who were crying: Why are you crying for Me? You cry for yourself for your future not for Me!

Like wise stop praying for Me, pray for your spiritual uplifment and put effort to please God by practically serving God in human form.....
Your condition is so serious that I went to church early today and prayed for your deliverance. I am not kidding. Hopefully other people care too. I don't think anyone except God can possibly persuade you. I will continue to make mention of you in my prayers, because it is that important.
 

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Rufus said:
dattaswami said:
Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
Jesus told to all those people who were crying: Why are you crying for Me? You cry for yourself for your future not for Me!

Like wise stop praying for Me, pray for your spiritual uplifment and put effort to please God by practically serving God in human form.....
Your condition is so serious that I went to church early today and prayed for your deliverance. I am not kidding. Hopefully other people care too. I don't think anyone except God can possibly persuade you. I will continue to make mention of you in my prayers, because it is that important.
Thank you for your kind rememberence of me in your prayers.....

When you pray and recommend for others to God, you are really insulting God!!

It means that you are very kind but God is not kind enough to show grace on me!!...

Also it means that you have to remind God of His duty to show grace on me!!!

It also means that you are very alert and genius and God is not so, hence GOD need a reminder to show grace on me...!!

By this you are really mocking the ominpotent God.

So stop recommanding my case to God. God knows what to do...

If i am eligible then He will bless me without your recommendation or prayer. If i am not eligible even if you pray or recommend for me, He will not bless me. So in either case your prayer and recommendation is a waste and also a way insulting God only!!

God knows His job, do not put your hand in His job. He is a very alter and intelligent administrator, do not play with Him by recommending Him for me!!!

Do your duty first, learn the divine knoweldge, try to practice it in your life, show real interest on God and try do practical service to Him. Search for God and His divine knoweldge on the earth. God is available in the present huamn form of God. You can identify Him from His wonderful divine knowledge.

Without that why are you praying for me... Are you smarter than God to recommand my case to Him? God knows His duty; do not remind Him of His duty. You are actually insulting GOd by recommending me to Him. You think that only if you pray or recommand to GOd, GOd acts!!

God knows His duty, He will judge anybody based on the merit. Your recommandation or pray will not effect the judgement of God. God rewards the merit not based on your praryer, jumping, clapping or weeping.

In front of GOd do not act. Be royal, no weeping, no crying, no jumping, no clapping- Please stop these non-senes infront of God. Do some pratical service to God, try to love God.

Why are you crying, why are you weeping, why are you jumping infront of God???

Whether GOd need your tears, whether GOd want to see your weeping,...stop all these non-sense. Be royal infront of God, try to love God, try to find the knolwedge of God. Stop crying and weeping. GOd is fed up with all your acting for a long time. Please stop all these drama infront of God. Instead you do some practical service to God, by finding Him in human form. Try to learn His divine knowledge.

God is fed up with your weeping and crying. Be royal...infront of God...
 

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Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
And in mine.  Somewhere in this lengthy thread I asked that we all pray for him.

-oOo-

Of course it is very tempting to poke fun.  I did that when I asked him about homosexual sex which comes highly recommended in the Kama Sutra.  The Kama Sutra is a text of divine origin in Hindu thinking.  But Swami disagreed, so I am thinking that maybe he is not a real Hindu.
 

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Irish Hermit said:
Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
And in mine.  Somewhere in this lengthy thread I asked that we all pray for him.

-oOo-

Of course it is very tempting to poke fun.   I did that when I asked him about homosexual sex which comes highly recommended in the Kama Sutra.  The Kama Sutra is a text of divine origin in Hindu thinking.   But Swami disagreed, so I am thinking that maybe he is not a real Hindu.
Kama sutra is not a divine knoweldge. Divine knowledge are Veda and Gita.

The Veda is the only authority in spirituality. It is the Word of the Lord in verse form. It was transmitted from generation to generation by the highly sophisticated tradition of oral recitation, which ensured preservation of the original verses without any corruption.

The great sage Vyasa says in the third Brahma sutra “Sastra yonitvat”. Sastra means Veda, which is the Word of the Ruler (sasaka). The Bhagavad Gita also says that the Sastra is the authority. The Bhagavad Gita was given by Lord K???a who is God Himself. It is said that the Bhagavad Gita is the essence of the Veda. One needs to carefully understand the meaning of this. Sugarcane juice is in the sugarcane but the sugarcane is not in the sugarcane juice. The sugarcane has more in it than merely juice. Thus when we say that the Bhagavad Gita is the essence of the Vedas, it means that the meaning of the verses in the Bhagavad Gita must be found in the Veda. However the entire Veda may not be found in the Bhagavad Gita. The Bhagavad Gita is thus a subset of the Vedas.

Therefore if the meaning of a verse in the Bhagavad Gita is not traceable to the Veda then it is safe to assume that that verse is not part of the original text and that Lord K???a never spoke this verse. Such a verse must have been added later on. Thus even in comparison with the Bhagavad Gita, the Veda alone stands as the authority. Any Sa?sk?tam verse from any book written by any sage or saint, (Sm?ti) should not oppose the Veda. That which is not told in the Veda, cannot be accepted even if the Sm?ti (Sruti sm?thi virodhetu) presents it. The statements and logic of the Sm?tis can be accepted only as long as it does not contradict the Veda. This has been clearly told by Sa?kara (Sruti mata? tarka?).

The logic behind accepting only statements which agree with the Veda is similar to the logic by which only the statement of a sane man is accepted and not that of a foolish man. The criteria of sanity or rationality that we impose in evaluating the veracity of a statement or experience of any person in day-to-day life is comparable to the criteria of agreement with the Veda of any spiritual work, experience or logic.

The Veda can be compared to the constitution of a nation. A law-maker or a lawyer in the court has to ensure that each law made and enforced is in keeping with the constitution. Any law that directly opposes the constitution cannot be accepted at any cost. In a court of law, only two lawyers are allowed to argue in the court. A lay man should employ an advocate on his behalf in the court as he is not competent enough to argue his own case. Similarly only two scholars of Vedas can argue on a concept relating to the Veda. A lay man or a person with little knowledge should not argue with a Vedic scholar (vivadasca samayo?). A lay man can be easily taught. A Vedic scholar can also be easily taught. However when it comes a person with partial knowledge, even Lord Brahma cannot convince him (brahmapi na rañjayati)
 

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dattaswami said:
Irish Hermit said:
Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
And in mine.  Somewhere in this lengthy thread I asked that we all pray for him.

-oOo-

Of course it is very tempting to poke fun.  I did that when I asked him about homosexual sex which comes highly recommended in the Kama Sutra.  The Kama Sutra is a text of divine origin in Hindu thinking.  But Swami disagreed, so I am thinking that maybe he is not a real Hindu.
Kama sutra is not a divine knoweldge. Divine knowledge are Veda and Gita.
The Kama Sutra is the oldest and most notable of a group of texts known generically as Kama Shastra (Sanskrit: Kāma Śāstra). Traditionally, the first transmission of Kama Shastra or "Discipline of Kama" is attributed to Nandi the sacred bull, Shiva's doorkeeper, who was moved to sacred utterance by overhearing the lovemaking of the god and his wife Parvati and later recorded his utterances for the benefit of mankind.

For Nandi reporting the utterance see: p. 3. Daniélou, Alain. The Complete Kama Sutra: The First Unabridged Modern Translation of the Classic Indian Text. Inner Traditions: 1993. ISBN 0-89281-525-6.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kama_Sutra#cite_note-2
 

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Irish Hermit said:
Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
And in mine.  Somewhere in this lengthy thread I asked that we all pray for him.

-oOo-

Of course it is very tempting to poke fun.   I did that when I asked him about homosexual sex which comes highly recommended in the Kama Sutra.  The Kama Sutra is a text of divine origin in Hindu thinking.   But Swami disagreed, so I am thinking that maybe he is not a real Hindu.
I think swami will say anything he thinks we want to hear.  He moves the goal posts a lot, and knows just enough about the Bible to be dangerous.
 

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Agia Marina said:
Irish Hermit said:
Ionnis said:
Regardless of what you say, you are in my prayers.  :)
And in mine.  Somewhere in this lengthy thread I asked that we all pray for him.

-oOo-

Of course it is very tempting to poke fun.   I did that when I asked him about homosexual sex which comes highly recommended in the Kama Sutra.  The Kama Sutra is a text of divine origin in Hindu thinking.   But Swami disagreed, so I am thinking that maybe he is not a real Hindu.
I think swami will say anything he thinks we want to hear.  He moves the goal posts a lot, and knows just enough about the Bible to be dangerous.
First of all, one should know that the concept of sex should not be magnified and should not be given over attention. Sex is a biological need of the body like hunger and thirst. It is a biological issue at physical level because, when the food is taken, a part of it is supplied to the reproductive system, by which, it gives signals in the form of sexual desire for the growth of human race on this earth. It is created by God for this purpose so that the souls come down to the earth through the bodies created by sexual union. Thus, sex is a factor involved in the divine mission, which functions in a circular way by bringing down the souls to the earth and taking them away from the earth.

The gross body is inert and is like a cloth of the soul. Sex is the momentary happiness that is experienced by the physical touch of the two inert gross bodies. People use the word ‘love’ for sex. Love is the quality of subtle body (the inner item), which is made of qualities. Sex is the physical action of the gross body, like hunger, thirst etc., which is a biological function.


Sex (kama) is related to body and love (Prema) is related to mind. Body and mind are mutually linked. Both sex and love are created by God for the divine work of reproduction of souls (dharma) which is the essential basis of His divine drama. All this is the issue between two souls only. After death, both sex and love disappear because even the recognition of the other soul does not exist any more. The love towards God is called as Bhakti, which is eternal, because the bond with God is eternal. Love is not eternal as it is limited to this birth only.
 

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Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Let us pray for Dattaswami, that God will remove far from him his delusions and fill him with the faith, hope and love which come from Him.

 

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Irish Hermit said:

Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Let us pray for Dattaswami, that God will remove far from him his delusions and fill him with the faith, hope and love which come from Him.
Thanks for your concern over me....

One should not reject true divine knowledge even if it is harsh

True knowledge is compared to fire (Jnaanaagnih….Gita) because no false hood can survive in it without becoming ash. Certainly the true knowledge is harsh and looks like impossible to practice. The impossibility may be now but not in the future. The souls of Gana have practiced the true spiritual knowledge and hence it is not impractical. The time taken to reach the stage of practice may be days or months or years or births. At least appreciate the truth, which is the first step in the practice. If you avoid the appreciation and criticize it so that you can escape its practice, you are gone forever.

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Hinduism.
The Power of the Pagan Gods
.


Hinduism's Assault
Upon Christianity
.


By Hieromonk Seraphim Rose

http://www.orthodoxcentral.com/fatheralexander/unzippedfiles/hinduism_e.doc
 

dattaswami

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Irish Hermit said:
Hinduism.
The Power of the Pagan Gods
.


Hinduism's Assault
Upon Christianity
.


By Hieromonk Seraphim Rose

http://www.orthodoxcentral.com/fatheralexander/unzippedfiles/hinduism_e.doc

Why are you linking religion with spiritual knowledge....??

Every Religion in this world wants you to get rid of bad qualities at least from today for the admission into that religion which is practically impossible. The reason is that these bad qualities were grown like hills for the past millions of births. This small human life is insufficient even to move them, not to speak of removing them. People can control the bad qualities to some extent by their efforts. These bad qualities are frequently sparking in the minds of even the most pious sages. If one says that he is good and he is devoid of all the bad qualities, it only cheating others, which in turn is cheating oneself. Due to this practically impossible condition, for the religious admission, people have developed allergy towards any religion because the eligibility for admission is impractical.

The religious preachers have confused the whole situation by fusing religion and spiritualism. Religion is the context of GOD to establish peace and justice in this world. In this context, you must control your bad qualities so that you will not disturb the peace and justice and will not harm any good person in this world. If you disturb the world by your bad qualities, God will punish you. But, in this context, it is sufficient if you control the bad qualities since you cannot remove them. The Religion ends here. Some religions strictly end here without any spiritualism.

The spiritualism is the context in which you have to make efforts to reach God. In this context, you need not even control your bad qualities because, God has no personal objection towards your bad qualities. These bad qualities cannot be obstacles in any manner in this context. Moreover, when you turn these bad qualities towards the God, they become your helpers. Any quality whether good or bad, is created by God only to help you in reaching Him. If you realize the original aim of all these qualities, good or bad, why should you control these qualities, which are with you as a helper? No fool controls his helpers. So, any quality when involved in spiritualism is used for its original aim, it becomes a good quality. So all your qualities become good in spiritualism and you need not put any effort to remove or even control them. When the qualities are not used for their original purpose, they become bad qualities. Therefore, whatever qualities turned towards the world, are bad qualities. In this spiritualism, there is no need of any effort even to control these bad qualities.

Then, for what, our effort should be made? Our effort should be concentrated to achieve “Bhakthi” which is the love on God. “Bhakthi” is achieved and is grown by the knowledge of God. For example, you came to know that Bombay City exists. This is the knowledge of existence of Bombay. By this you want to see Bombay. As you know the details of Bombay more and more, your desire to see the city becomes more and more. Knowing details about the Bombay City is again the further knowledge. So, knowledge is directly proportional to desire. First Rukmini heard that there is Lord Krishna on this earth. As she heard more and more about Lord Krishna from Sage Narada, her love on Krishna increased enormously. Narada means he who gives knowledge. Therefore, ‘Jnana”(knowledge) generates and develops “Bhakthi (devotion)”. Due to Bhakthi, the Lord is attained. Gita says the same ‘ONLY BY BHAKTHI I AM ATTAINED’ (‘Bhaktya………’).
 

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[size=8pt]Hinduism
The Power of the Pagan Gods


Hinduism's Assault
Upon Christianity

By Hieromonk Seraphim Rose

http://www.orthodoxcentral.com/fatheralexander/unzippedfiles/hinduism_e.doc

"Today christianity is taking the thrusts of a foe that is all but invisible to the faithful. And if it can, it will pierce to the heart before declaring its name. The enemy is Hinduism, and the war being waged is a war of dogma."
 

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Irish Hermit said:

Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Let us pray for Dattaswami, that God will remove far from him his delusions and fill him with the faith, hope and love which come from Him.
]]
I appreciate you good heart... It is very good. In additon to it you shall develop love on God without any expecation of anything in return from Him. This is the secret to become very close to God...
 

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Irish Hermit said:

Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Let us pray for Dattaswami, that God will remove far from him his delusions and fill him with the faith, hope and love which come from Him.
Lord, have mercy. 
Lord, have mercy. 
Lord, have mercy.
 

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Irish Hermit said:

Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Let us pray for Dattaswami, that God will remove far from him his delusions and fill him with the faith, hope and love which come from Him.
Lord have mercy on our brother Venu Gopala! By the prayers of our father St. John Chrysostom, deliver Venu Gopala of the oppression of the evil one, release him from the chains of hell, heal him from the arrows of the enemy, throw that slanderous spirit in the darkness prepared for him and save the soul of Your creation Venu Gopala! Cast down from the life of Venu Gopala that old accuser, send your Archangel Michael as before, to destroy the power of the devil upon the life of Venu Gopala! Lord haver mercy, Lord have mercy, Lord have mercy!

St. John Chrysostom prayer:

O Eternal God, Who has redeemed the race of men from the captivity of the devil, deliver Thy servant Venu Gopala from all the workings of unclean spirits. Command the evil and impure spirits and demons to depart from the soul and body of your servant Venu Gopala and not to remain nor hide in him. Let them be banished from this the creation of Thy hands in Thine own holy name and that of Thine only begotten Son and of Thy life-creating Spirit, so that, after being cleansed from all demonic influence, he may live godly, justly and righteously and may be counted worthy to receive the Holy Mysteries of Thine only-begotten Son and our God with Whom Thou art blessed and glorified together with the all holy and good and life-creating Spirit now and ever and unto the ages of ages. Amen.

O Thou Who hast rebuked all unclean spirits and by the power of Thy Word has banished the legion, come now, through Thine only begotten Son upon this creature, which Thou hast fashioned in Thine own image and deliver him from the adversary that holds him in bondage, so that, receiving Thy mercy and becoming purified, he might join the ranks of Thy holy flock and be preserved as a living temple of the Holy Spirit and might receive the divine and holy Mysteries through the grace and compassion and loving kindness of Thine only-begotten Son with Whom Thou art blessed together with Thine all-holy and good and life-creating Spirit now and ever and unto the ages of ages. Amen.

We beseech Thee, O Lord, Almighty God, Most High, untempted, peaceful King. We beseech Thee Who has created the heaven and the earth, for out of Thee has issued the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, Thou Who has ordained that the fourfooted and irrational beasts be under subjection to man, for Thou hast subjected them. Lord, stretch out Thy mighty hand and Thy sublime and holy arm and in Thy watchful care look down upon this Thy creature and send down upon him a peaceful angel, a mighty angel, a guardian of soul and body, that will rebuke and drive away every evil and unclean demon from him, for Thou alone are Lord, Most High, almighty and blessed unto ages of ages. Amen.

We make this great, divine, holy and awesome invocation and plea, O devil, for thine expulsion, as well as this rebuke for your utter annihilation, O apostate! God Who is holy, beginningless, frightful, invisible in essence, infinite in power and incomprehensible in divinity, the King of glory and Lord Almighty, He shall rebuke thee, devil! -- He Who composed all things well by his Word from nothingness into being; He Who walks upon the wings of the air. The Lord rebukes thee, devil! -- He Who calls forth the water of the sea and pours it upon the face of all the earth. Lord of Hosts is His name. Devil: the Lord rebukes thee! He Who is ministered to and praised by numberless heavenly orders and adored and glorified in fear by multitudes of angelic and archangelic hosts. Satan: the Lord rebukes thee! He Who is honored by the encircling Powers, the awesome six-winged and many-eyed Cherubim and Seraphim that cover their faces with two wings because of His inscrutable and unseen divinity and with two wings cover their feet, lest they be seared by His unutterable glory and incomprehensible majesty, and with two wings do fly and fill the heavens with their shouts of "Holy, holy, holy, Lord Sabaoth, heaven and earth are full of Thy glory!" Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who came down from the Father's bosom and, through the holy, inexpressible, immaculate and adorable Incarnation from the Virgin, appeared ineffably in the world to save it and cast thee down from heaven in His authoritative power and showed thee to be an outcast to every man. Satan: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who said to the sea, be silent, be still, and instantly it was calmed at His command. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who made clay with His immaculate spittle and refashioned the wanting member of the man blind from birth and gave him his sight. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who by His word restored to life the daughter of the ruler of the synagogue and snatched the son of the widow out from the mouth of death and gave him whole and sound to his own mother. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! The Lord Who raised Lazarus the four-days dead from the dead, undecayed, as if not having died, and unblemished to the astonishment of many. Satan: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who destroyed the curse by the blow on His face and by the lance in His immaculate side lifted the flaming sword that guarded Paradise. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who dried all tears from every face by the spitting upon His precious expressed image. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who set His Cross as a support, the salvation of the world, to thy fall and the fall of all the angels under thee. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who spoke from His Cross and the curtain of the temple was torn in two, and the rocks were split and the tombs were opened and those who were dead from the ages were raised up. Devil: The Lord rebukes thee! He Who by death put death to death and by His rising granted life to all men. May the Lord rebuke thee, Satan! -- that is, He Who descended into Hades and opened its tombs and set free those held prisoner in it, calling them to Himself; before Whom the gatekeepers of Hades shuddered when they saw Him and, hiding themselves, vanished in the anguish of Hades. May the Lord rebuke thee, devil! -- That is, Christ our God Who arose from the dead and granted His Resurrection to all men.

May the Lord rebuke thee, Satan! -- He Who in glory ascended into heaven to His Father, sitting on the right of majesty upon the throne of glory. Devil: May the Lord rebuke thee! He Who shall come again with glory upon the clouds of heaven with His holy angels to judge the living and the dead. Devil: May the Lord rebuke thee! He Who has prepared for thee unquenchable fire, the unsleeping worm and the outer darkness unto eternal punishment. Devil: May the Lord rebuke thee! For before Him all things shudder and tremble from the face of His power and the wrath of His warning upon thee is uncontainable. Satan: The Lord rebukes thee by His frightful name!

Shudder, tremble, be afraid, depart, be utterly destroyed, be banished! Thee who fell from heaven and together with thee all evil spirits: every evil spirit of lust, the spirit of evil, a day and nocturnal spirit, a noonday and evening spirit, a midnight spirit, an imaginative spirit, an encountering spirit, either of the dry land or of the water, or one in a forest, or among the reeds, or in trenches, or in a road or a crossroad, in lakes, or streams, in houses, or one sprinkling in the baths and chambers, or one altering the mind of man. Depart swiftly from this creature of the Creator Christ our God! And be gone from the servant of God, Venu Gopala, from his mind, from his soul, from his heart, from his reins, from his senses, from all his members, that he might become whole and sound and free, knowing God, his own Master and Creator of all things, He Who gathers together those who have gone astray and Who gives them the seal of salvation through the rebirth and restoration of divine Baptism, so that he may be counted worthy of His immaculate, heavenly and awesome Mysteries and be united to His true fold, dwelling in a place of pasture and nourished on the waters of repose, guided pastorally and safely by the staff of the Cross unto the forgiveness of sins and life everlasting. For unto Him belong all glory, honor, adoration and majesty together with Thy beginningless Father and His all-holy, good and life-giving Spirit, now and ever, and unto ages of ages. Amen.

 

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I would like to beg specially to all the clergy present in this forum to pray St. John's prayer above privately, for our brother Venu Gopala.

And also to ask all forum members to use his real name, Venu Gopala, instead of the dellusional identity the devil has imposed on him.
 

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Fabio Leite said:
I would like to beg specially to all the clergy present in this forum to pray St. John's prayer above privately, for our brother Venu Gopala.

And also to ask all forum members to use his real name, Venu Gopala, instead of the dellusional identity the devil has imposed on him.
Thank you for the reminder, Fabio.
 

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Prayer of ordinary person Vs a high level devotee

Ganapati means the Lord of a group of close devotees, who have reached the climax of devotion. The word Gana does not mean the entire group of normal souls. Gana means a group of souls, who have become very close to the Lord by their unimaginable devotion. The Lord is certainly the master of all the souls, but the Gana is specially attached group of souls. The king is attached to the people in his kingdom, but he is specially attached to his family members.  There is difference in the intensity of the attachments. When the Lord incarnates on this earth in human form, these souls from the Gana also accompany the Lord. These liberated souls have no bondage of the cycle of deeds and their lives are totally planned by the Lord.

For example, if you take the life of Jesus, His crucifixion was not due to His past deeds and it was purely based on the will of the Lord, who planned such incident in His life for the sake of uplift of the society. Therefore, Jesus prayed “Let Thy will be done”. Here the crucifixion is according to the will of the Lord. The same statement cannot be uttered by an ordinary human being in such situation.  The crucifixion of other two persons in the same time was based on their sins. Therefore, they cannot utter this statement because their lives were based on their deeds and not on the plan of God’s will. In the case of these two ordinary human beings, the proper statement should be “Let the Law take its own course”.  Without this analysis, ordinary human beings also utter the former statement due to ignorance.
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[quote/]
St. John Chrysostom prayer:

O Eternal God, Who has redeemed the race of men from the captivity of the devil, deliver Thy servant Venu Gopala fro.......... not pleased with you and no fruit is seen for such wasteful external means.  
[/qoute]

Thank you very much for those beatiful prayer for me. I also pray that let God answer your prayers.

Mean while i tell you about the difference between prayers of ordinary people Vs prayer of God's real devotee:


When Sankara( a previous human incarnation) chanted Kanaka Dhara prayer the golden fruits fell as a rain even an ordinary fruit is not falling from the tree in spite of our chanting hundred times the same prayer.  What is the reason?

Answer for the above:

One person got M.A. degree by working hard.  He applied for the post of a lecturer and attended the interview in neat dress.  He got the post.  Another fellow who failed 10th class is putting 100 applications for the same post everywhere.  He is going to the interview in very very attractive dress.  Such fellow is not even called into the room of interview.  I know in the olden days, a person received the appointment order for the post of  a lecturer from the Government even before the result of his M.A. degree was declared from the university.  The Government got the pass list from the university before it is announced.  Therefore if you have the deserving degree, you need not apply and need not go to the interview.  The order of appointment will come directly to your house.

 Similarly your chanting of the prayer is your application.  Your silk cloth, garlands, sacred ash on the forehead etc., compose the neat dress for the interview.

The practical sacrifice for the sake of the Lord crossing the family bonds is the real deserving M.A. degree, you must work hard to attain that degree.  Without doing that what is the use of all these external things.  Sankara sacrificed His old mother for the sake of the mission of the Lord, which is the propagation of divine knowledge.

 The deserving qualification of Sankara was responsible for that rain of golden fruits.  The prayer chanted by Him was merely a formal application for the post.  Even that application is not necessary if you have the deserving qualification.  Sabari, Kannappa, Elephant, Spider and Serpant never asked the Lord for anything.  Their practical sacrifice was their deserving qualifiation.  Our present tradition is preaching you to attain the external means only without the real internal deserving qualification.  Therefore the Lord is not pleased with you and no fruit is seen for such wasteful external means.  
 

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Venu,

the fruit will appear when the seeds in your heart grow. Repent and with a contrict heart call out for Jesus Christ, your Lord. You are not even a "real devotee" right now, and you know that very well. Never one single prayer of yours has been answered, you have rationalized everything with excuses. But that is not because God has forgotten you. He loves you more than you'll ever know. Stop lying to yourself, put your trust in Jesus Christ. What you have not been able to solve, He is going to solve for you, what was wrong, He will mend for you. He *can* heal you Venu, He can soothe your pains, He can protect you, He is waiting to have you in His arms, you don't have to hide anymore, there is no danger when God calls for you. Leave these lies behind, Venu, and rush to Jesus Christ. Pray. Pray for the first time in your life, not pridefully like something you're not, but truly, with humbleness of being Venu Gopala, the sinner, the broken man who needs God, who is His creation. Then look for an Orthodox parish, pray in silence at the backpart, start being part of the community with humbleness, seek cathecumanate with a spirit of learning and not of teaching. Be silent and learn with humbleness not only what is said, but what is done. Than be baptized, chrysmated and receive the Holy Body of Jesus Christ and His Most Pure Blood, live a good and humble life in the bosom of the Lord.
 

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dattaswami, if you trust in the word of the Gospels and Epistles, the Acts and Revelation, then there is no need for another human incarnation of God.  The Son of God became incarnate, and dwelt among us, and ascended body and soul, humanity and divinity to the Right Hand of the Father on High.  God may be dwelling in you, but He also dwells in us all, I believe, through through the reception of Holy Communion, through being sealed with the Holy Spirit at Chrismation, through being plunged through the waters at Baptism.  There is no special revelation, no secret faith, for all is made clear and bare through the Light of Life, the teaching of the Apostles.  Take your Hindu Gnosticism away with you, in the Name of the Lord who made the Heavens and the Earth, the Seas and all that is in them.  We know our Shepherd - He not only revealed Himself to us, and told us what to expect, but He remains with us, guiding and guarding us.  You have come not as the shepherd, but as a thief; as one who tries to divide the flock into higher and lower levels, more and less enlightened, so that as divided you can devour them in smaller pieces, less able to defend themselves.  We are not fooled, and we are not swayed by your passionate appeals to mysticism and your pagan gods; for we know the One Who Is, the Everlasting God, the God of our Fathers - you are not He, and those you extol are not He, and the One you invoke, the Son of the Living God, is not one with those others that you invoke also.  You are possessed by a blasphemous tongue; abandon it, accept repentance and confession, and become a member of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church, the Body and Bride of Christ, the successors of the Apostles and the Vessels of the Holy Spirit in the world.
 

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Fr. George said:
dattaswami, if you trust in the word of the Gospels and Epistles, the Acts and Revelation, then there is no need for another human incarnation of God.  The Son of God became incarnate, and dwelt among us, and ascended body and soul, humanity and divinity to the Right Hand of the Father on High.  God may be dwelling in you, but He also dwells in us all, I believe, through through the reception of Holy Communion, through being sealed with the Holy Spirit at Chrismation, through being plunged through the waters at Baptism.  There is no special revelation, no secret faith, for all is made clear and bare through the Light of Life, the teaching of the Apostles.  Take your Hindu Gnosticism away with you, in the Name of the Lord who made the Heavens and the Earth, the Seas and all that is in them.  We know our Shepherd - He not only revealed Himself to us, and told us what to expect, but He remains with us, guiding and guarding us.  You have come not as the shepherd, but as a thief; as one who tries to divide the flock into higher and lower levels, more and less enlightened, so that as divided you can devour them in smaller pieces, less able to defend themselves.  We are not fooled, and we are not swayed by your passionate appeals to mysticism and your pagan gods; for we know the One Who Is, the Everlasting God, the God of our Fathers - you are not He, and those you extol are not He, and the One you invoke, the Son of the Living God, is not one with those others that you invoke also.  You are possessed by a blasphemous tongue; abandon it, accept repentance and confession, and become a member of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church, the Body and Bride of Christ, the successors of the Apostles and the Vessels of the Holy Spirit in the world.
And with these excellent words of wisdom, I recommend that this thread now be locked! For what more needs to be said than what Father George has so eloquently and succinctly stated here?


Selam
 
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