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Clouds on Mars

Friul

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It snows on Mars. This occurs, at least in the northern arctic region where the Phoenix lander set up camp in 2008. Science teams from Phoenix were able to observe water-ice clouds in the Martian atmosphere and precipitation that fell to the ground at night and sublimate into water in the morning. James Whiteway and his colleagues say that clouds and precipitation on Mars play a role in the exchange of water between the ground and the atmosphere and when conditions are right, snow falls regularly on Mars.

“Before Phoenix we did not know whether precipitation occurs on Mars,” Whiteway said. “We knew that the polar ice cap advances as far south as the Phoenix site in winter, but we did not know how the water vapor
moved from the atmosphere to ice on the ground. Now we know that it does snow, and that this is part of the hydrological cycle on Mars.”

Source
And from York University's website:

http://www.yorku.ca/mediar/archive/Release.php?Release=1710
 

chris

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Glory to God!

I love things like this! Thank you for posting this!
 

tableserver

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I don't think snow can sublimate into water.  It melts into water.  Very neat, though.
 

findingfaith

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Thanks for the article, very cool.



tableserver said:
I don't think snow can sublimate into water.  It melts into water.  Very neat, though.
Sublimation of an element or compound is a transition from the solid to gas phase with no intermediate liquid stage. Sublimation is an endothermic phase transition that occurs at temperatures and pressures below the triple point (see phase diagram). At normal pressures, most chemical compounds and elements possess three different states at different temperatures. In these cases the transition from the solid to the gaseous state requires an intermediate liquid state. However, for some elements or substances at some pressures the material may pass directly from a solid into the gaseous state. This can occur if the atmospheric pressure exerted on the substance is too low to stop the molecules from escaping from the solid state.


From Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublimation_(chemistry)
 

stashko

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Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
 

EofK

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stashko said:
Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
It might be if they tried bacteria or other such things, but for the moment most of those studying it are more interested in seeing if there are already native forms of life surviving there.  It would be a shame, too, to introduce bacteria from Earth and have it kill off any native life there might be on Mars. 
 

stashko

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EofK said:
stashko said:
Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
It might be if they tried bacteria or other such things, but for the moment most of those studying it are more interested in seeing if there are already native forms of life surviving there.  It would be a shame, too, to introduce bacteria from Earth and have it kill off any native life there might be on Mars. 
It looks so desolete Barren,very depressing......they should try something......
 

findingfaith

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stashko said:
EofK said:
stashko said:
Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
It might be if they tried bacteria or other such things, but for the moment most of those studying it are more interested in seeing if there are already native forms of life surviving there.  It would be a shame, too, to introduce bacteria from Earth and have it kill off any native life there might be on Mars. 
It looks so desolete Barren,very depressing......they should try something......
The task is so immense, it will be a century or more before we could do anything even remotely effective. The reasons are many, The martian soil is highly acidic, and salty, both bad for plant growth, There is no bio material to speak of, and no microbial bacteria, which is what turns bio mass into nutrient rich soil, like making compost. so it's not just a matter of releasing some bacteria on mars, you would have to actually try to reclaim the soil, which is a monumental task to say the least. not to mention you would have to pack all the equipment needed to mars after years of design and testing.
 

tableserver

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I think what they meant was that the snow sublimates into water vapor, not water since you normally don't sublimate into water.  That seems more plausible since water would likely be very unstable with such low atmospheric pressure.  That's the big problem.  Growing surface life without atmosphere, and creating atmosphere without surface life...



tableserver said:
I don't think snow can sublimate into water.  It melts into water.  Very neat, though.
Sublimation of an element or compound is a transition from the solid to gas phase with no intermediate liquid stage. Sublimation is an endothermic phase transition that occurs at temperatures and pressures below the triple point (see phase diagram). At normal pressures, most chemical compounds and elements possess three different states at different temperatures. In these cases the transition from the solid to the gaseous state requires an intermediate liquid state. However, for some elements or substances at some pressures the material may pass directly from a solid into the gaseous state. This can occur if the atmospheric pressure exerted on the substance is too low to stop the molecules from escaping from the solid state.


From Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublimation_(chemistry)
[/quote]
 

Ebor

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stashko said:
Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
There are a number of science fiction works that consider aspects of "Terra-forming" Mars, that is doing things to make the planet more like our world.  The largest one is the "Mars" trilogy by Kim Stanley Robinson: Red Mars, Green Mars and Blue Mars.

We are not yet at the stage where we could change the environment of an entire world.  One question is should we even do so, if we ever have that capability and if so, why? 

Good Science Fiction will take serious considerations of possible futures and actions and ethics.

Ebor
 

findingfaith

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Ebor said:
stashko said:
Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
There are a number of science fiction works that consider aspects of "Terra-forming" Mars, that is doing things to make the planet more like our world.  The largest one is the "Mars" trilogy by Kim Stanley Robinson: Red Mars, Green Mars and Blue Mars.

We are not yet at the stage where we could change the environment of an entire world.  One question is should we even do so, if we ever have that capability and if so, why? 

Good Science Fiction will take serious considerations of possible futures and actions and ethics.

Ebor
What a great set of books that is, so well Written, got red mars from the library, liked it so much, I went out and bought the set. I have had a love of good science fiction and fantasy books since childhood when my dad gave me Asimov's foundation and empire, and some of piers anthony's xanth novels.

One question is should we even do so
So true, seems like man, trying to play God to me
 

Friul

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Ebor said:
One question is should we even do so, if we ever have that capability and if so, why?
Yes.  ;D  What an absolutely amazing, large scale experiment that would produce countless opportunities to learn about our very world, let alone another.  I don't think it is a matter of if we were have the capability to do so, but a matter of when we will have the technology and capital to do so.
 

Crucifer

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findingfaith said:
Thanks for the article, very cool.



tableserver said:
I don't think snow can sublimate into water.  It melts into water.  Very neat, though.
Sublimation of an element or compound is a transition from the solid to gas phase with no intermediate liquid stage. Sublimation is an endothermic phase transition that occurs at temperatures and pressures below the triple point (see phase diagram). At normal pressures, most chemical compounds and elements possess three different states at different temperatures. In these cases the transition from the solid to the gaseous state requires an intermediate liquid state. However, for some elements or substances at some pressures the material may pass directly from a solid into the gaseous state. This can occur if the atmospheric pressure exerted on the substance is too low to stop the molecules from escaping from the solid state.


From Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublimation_(chemistry)
"Dry" ice is a common substance which sublimates, going from solid to gas.
 

Ebor

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findingfaith said:
Ebor said:
stashko said:
Curious.. Is it possible to seed the planet mars with extreme weather plants to change the environment of mars.....
There are a number of science fiction works that consider aspects of "Terra-forming" Mars, that is doing things to make the planet more like our world.  The largest one is the "Mars" trilogy by Kim Stanley Robinson: Red Mars, Green Mars and Blue Mars.

We are not yet at the stage where we could change the environment of an entire world.  One question is should we even do so, if we ever have that capability and if so, why? 

Good Science Fiction will take serious considerations of possible futures and actions and ethics.

Ebor
What a great set of books that is, so well Written, got red mars from the library, liked it so much, I went out and bought the set. I have had a love of good science fiction and fantasy books since childhood when my dad gave me Asimov's foundation and empire, and some of piers anthony's xanth novels.
Ah!  another science fiction reader!  Excellent.  I started when I found a couple of Heinlein "juveniles" in the school library.  As I recall they were Red Planet and Rocket Ship Galileo.  I've been reading since then for over 42 years.  :)

 
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