Converts wearing headcoverings= legalists?

[Deep Roots]

Maria, stop using the phrase "judged" to refer to yourself and women who wear headcoverings unless you are prepared to apply the same standard to those who judge non-wearers.

Every time you use the word in that way, you parody yourself.  Do not judge -- the wearer (you) or the nonwearer (someone else).  What don't you get about this?

 

[SolEX01]

I was applying the parable of the Publican and the Pharisee to a convert or cathechumen who wears a headcovering and receives preferential treatment for doing so.

This statement of yours is way off topic, and you know it. I will not respond to the rest of your off topic feminist rant.

What off topic feminist rant?   ???

Back on Topic:

In my experience, converts wearing headcoverings would be rashly judged to be proud and legalistic. This goes against Christ's command not to judge.

If a convert were to wear a headcovering in many of the jurisdictions of World Orthodoxy (especially outside the ROCOR), they would most likely suffer taunts, gossip, and ridicule from other women who hold a feminist agenda. These converts WOULD NOT receive any preferential treatment, but would be shunned by the feminists.

That's your experience; you don't speak for all female converts to Orthodoxy.

Are you a convert who wears a headcovering? If not, please be honest and excuse yourself from this thread.

No to both questions.  I'm here to dispel hypocrisy and to differentiate between freely wearing a headcovering and being forced to wear a headcovering.

I am a convert and I do wear a headcovering out of obedience.

You freely wear a headcovering.

When I first converted, my priest granted me grace and told me to wear the headcovering only at Communion time.

In the OCA, at that time?  He didn't force you to wear a headcovering; you chose to wear one.

Now I wear it during the entire Divine Liturgy with his blessing and that of my husband.

You're no longer in the OCA; your Old Calendarist priest allows you to wear your headcovering.

During summer, I would rather not wear it as it is too hot (120 degrees sometimes), but I wear it in obedience disregarding my own discomfort to set a good example, per my priest.

I have no opinion towards headcoverings; that is for each woman to decide freely; however, there should not be adverse consequences for failing to wear one nor should a woman receive preferential treatment for wearing a headcovering whether at a monastery or any Orthodox church.

 

[Maria]

Converts who wear headcoverings are learning obedience

Obedience to what?

and trying to undo Eve's disobedience.

That's already been undone.

Since they are imitating the New Eve, the Most Holy Theotokos, who wore the veil even though she was without sin, how can these converts be judged to be legalistic?

So a convert has to become the Most Holy Theotokos - like the boast of the Pharisee.

Frankly, I think that this is only a slur (a slur that I hear a lot from feminists) to discourage women from wearing headcoverings. These feminists would destroy our church. They are the unscrupulous ones.

In your jurisdiction, feminism doesn't exist?

Off topic. I will not respond.

Converts who wear headcoverings are imitating the Most Holy Theotokos,
and She happens to be my patron saint.

 

[Maria]

I was applying the parable of the Publican and the Pharisee to a convert or cathechumen who wears a headcovering and receives preferential treatment for doing so.

This statement of yours is way off topic, and you know it. I will not respond to the rest of your off topic feminist rant.

What off topic feminist rant?   ???

Back on Topic:

In my experience, converts wearing headcoverings would be rashly judged to be proud and legalistic. This goes against Christ's command not to judge.

If a convert were to wear a headcovering in many of the jurisdictions of World Orthodoxy (especially outside the ROCOR), they would most likely suffer taunts, gossip, and ridicule from other women who hold a feminist agenda. These converts WOULD NOT receive any preferential treatment, but would be shunned by the feminists.

That's your experience; you don't speak for all female converts to Orthodoxy.

Are you a convert who wears a headcovering? If not, please be honest and excuse yourself from this thread.

No to both questions.  I'm here to dispel hypocrisy and to differentiate between freely wearing a headcovering and being forced to wear a headcovering.

I am a convert and I do wear a headcovering out of obedience.

You freely wear a headcovering.

When I first converted, my priest granted me grace and told me to wear the headcovering only at Communion time.

In the OCA, at that time?  He didn't force you to wear a headcovering; you chose to wear one.

Now I wear it during the entire Divine Liturgy with his blessing and that of my husband.

You're no longer in the OCA; your Old Calendarist priest allows you to wear your headcovering.

During summer, I would rather not wear it as it is too hot (120 degrees sometimes), but I wear it in obedience disregarding my own discomfort to set a good example, per my priest.

I have no opinion towards headcoverings; that is for each woman to decide freely; however, there should not be adverse consequences for failing to wear one whether at a monastery or any Orthodox church.

Off topic. I refuse to respond to any of this feministic ranting.

 

[Maria]

Maria, stop using the phrase "judged" to refer to yourself and women who wear headcoverings unless you are prepared to apply the same standard to those who judge non-wearers.

Every time you use the word in that way, you parody yourself.  Do not judge -- the wearer (you) or the nonwearer (someone else).  What don't you get about this?

non sequitur and very off topic

 

[Deep Roots]

Maria, stop using the phrase "judged" to refer to yourself and women who wear headcoverings unless you are prepared to apply the same standard to those who judge non-wearers.

Every time you use the word in that way, you parody yourself.  Do not judge -- the wearer (you) or the nonwearer (someone else).  What don't you get about this?

non sequitur and very off topic

It's off topic?  It's entirely on topic.  You're blinded by your own self-righteousness and false humility.  And a real piece of work.

 

[mike]

Converts who wear headcoverings are imitating the Most Holy Theotokos,
and She happens to be my patron saint.

That's not traditional. Theotokos is not to be one's patron-Saint.

Liberals everywhere.

 

[PeterTheAleut]

Seeing that tempers have flared up again and that the polemics are flying around again, I have locked this thread until Thomas has had a chance to review this and decide what to do with it. If you wish to take parts of this discussion to one of the other active head covering threads, I won't consider that an attempt to circumvent the lock on this thread, since this lock is necessitated only by this thread's location on Convert Issues.

 

[Thomas]

I have reviewed the latest statements and now close and lock this topic in agreement with Peter the Aleut. It has failed to stay on topic and the debate has become more than permitted in the Convert Issues Forum.

Thomas
Convert Issues Forum Moderator