- Mar 8, 2006
- Reaction score
- Portland, Oregon
I think that's self-evident.jckstraw72 said:you are attempting to persuade myself and others that I am fabricating a false concensus, and that I am merely proof-texting.PeterTheAleut said:You just don't get it, do you? I'm not arguing anything except that you bear ALL the burden of proof in this argument, since you are the one trying to prove something. I'm not trying to prove anything.jckstraw72 said:who are these Fathers that don't embrace the POV of all the other Fathers? Seriously, WHO ARE THEY? your whole argument pinges upon that, but yet you never present these other Fathers, you just assume that I am aware of Fathers who denied the literal level of Genesis and that I just ignore them. Literally, I've never seen such Patristic writings anywhere.
But I'm not offering my own interpretation of Scripture. Besides, others here have already done the work of demonstrating an alternate point of view from the Fathers.jckstraw72 said:This would imply that there is actually another viewpoint that could be presented but which I am ignoring. There is a burden on you to demonstrate that there is actually a variant viewpoint in the history of the Church. Otherwise your interpretation of Scripture is completely your own which is a Protestant thing to do.
But the way you've approached this argument on this thread, it is you and you alone who are organizing pertinent and related Patristic writings into a single body of work with the goal of persuading us to adopt your particular point of view as if it were Church dogma. So I am not questioning, nor have I ever questioned the Fathers. I have only questioned you. As I said before on this thread, it's all about you.jckstraw72 said:I'm not attempting to formulate any teaching. I'm presenting to you the words of the illumined Fathers. If anyone is fabricating a teaching I guess it would have to be them. and yes, i think its necessary to establish that death, the great enemy of creation, is not God's fault but rather is our fault. If we blame God for death then we're really not much better than Calvinists.jckstraw72 said:No, I just think you're being too dogmatic about this and trying to formulate Church teaching where none is even necessary.And let's not forget that I've also provided hymns, canons, icons, and Scripture as well. Your understanding of a concensus seems to very strange, and you make it basically impossible to ever demonstrate what the Church teaches ... on anything.