Dating/relationship shoulds

Anastasia1

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How can I learn to distinguish shoulds in what to look for vs. optionals?
What kind of things should I look for and what is just up to me?
 

Jovan

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Hello Anastasia, I hope everything is fine with you my sister in the Lord. Please forgive me if my answer doesn´t address your question properly.

My personal advice on this, as I assume from reading some of your other posts, that your in process of meeting someone.
Keep a strong hold of your faith,with truth, openness and honesty on things, questions and matters that eventually will pop up.
You seem like a woman with a big heart, full of faith and love. Don´t let that be nr 2 when the questions on job, income, church attendance, fasting and tons of issues arise.

From personal experience, I always felt that the answers was at hand, I should do this Jovan, I should ask about this Jovan, I MUST ask of her view on this issue etc. The problem for me was that I never did anything of this, out fear for man and his judgement. If your opinion, in accordance with the church ( AND ofcourse spiritual guidance from your priest) is clear, than make that clear to him. If faith is nr 1 for you, make that clear to him at once.

You will know the shoulds in good time my dear sister. But the things that becomes optional is when we feel that the shoulds become hinders in the relationship.

One example I can come up with could be on confession. If you meet someone that goes to church, keeps with all the dates and celebrations but never makes confessions to the priest as well as receiving communion. That is totally optional on his own side, but for your sake, you know what the "should" should be for him in this case. That he should regard the sacraments as something to strengthen his relationship with God, and therefore in the long term with you. Keeping in on sins will affect people around him.

This was just an example, but the should always stands clear in something optional I think. If confession to priest doesn´t matter in a relationship, then someone within it will receive an entire confession before breaking up :p

Same goes with income, family, ethnicity. Is he rich and you poor. If that matters to him but you feel it optional, then it will become a problem sooner or later. The should is that it doesn´t matter :D

Forgive me for an bombastic respond, pray and forgive me sister. I pray that God richly guide you with all the shoulds and bless you into a wonderful journey :)
 

Asteriktos

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I'm afraid, at least in my experience, it's almost impossible to figure out ahead of time. The most you can do is figure out what you think about such-and-such, admitting that it has to be flexible, not necessarily how you'll respond.  For example, you might say that you absolutely, positively, definitely will not date someone who smokes. Then you might meet someone that is your dream guy, except that he smokes, and suddenly realize that you're more than happy to look past the smoking. The should and ratings and judgments and requirements we make up in our heads often don't transfer well to real life. What's that saying about boxers and mma guys, something like "every fighter has a plan, until they get hit..."  Same thing with dating.
 

yeshuaisiam

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Look at how he treats his mothers and sisters (if applicable).

When you decide, remember that this man will be your head, and you'll be submitting to him.  If he treats his mother well, he could very likely treat you well.  Take into consideration the headship order, and if you can trust him, you'll grow strong in a Christian relationship.
 

Jovan

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Beautiful advices brothers/sisters. Will eventually God willing help me, when I´m ready ;P
 

Quinault

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The small things are the best things to look for;

Does he just try and be you "head" while dating? When at a restaurant, does he want to order *for you*? That sort of personality will persist and even be more pronounced in marriage. Some women like that sort of thing. That would drive me nuts.

Does he try to open doors for you? Like when getting into the car, does he unlock and open your door first, and then walk around to his side to get in? Or does he just get into the car and lean across to unlock your side? A man that always insists upon getting in first is going to insist upon being first in all things. Or he is so lazy, he doesn't want to go thru the extra effort to be a gentleman :laugh:

Is the man trying to up the physical aspect quickly? Everyone has a timeline for these things. But if a man wants to start kissing within a month of meeting, I think it is a very bad sign. A month isn't long enough to know anyone well enough to start swapping bodily fluids. The chemistry/desire can be there. But if a guy "can't help himself" when it comes to gropping you, that isn't a good sign.

How does he talk about children? Is his longing for children stronger than his desire to have a partner in life? No woman wants to be a walking womb. But it isn't a good sign if a man wants to be so much of a free spirit that he can't imagine ever settling down to have a normal life. Road life can be fun, but eventually everyone has to settle down for awhile. If his attitude is a passive- eh, I don't know? maybe I will want to settle down someday? Then he isn't mature enough for a relationship. The same would go for his attitude toward marriage. You don't want a man that is desperate to get married ASAP. If he has a sort of "whenever" attitude, that whenever may never come. Dating for decades isn't a replacement for an actual marriage. But desperation for marriage isn't a good sign either. The time when you are dating you are laying a foundation for your marriage. A man that wants to jumpstart the process has reasons for it, and they aren't always good ones. Yes, a quick marriage can be successful, but in the current society they often aren't.

How well does he deal with stress? Does he curse and freak out at every game, traffic delay or political turn? If he is "passionate" about every little thing in life, he may not be capable of discerning what is worth fighting for, and what is worth walking away from. If he is valium cool about everything then that isn't a good sign either. A man should be passionate about the things that matter; faith, family, friends. But everything else should have a moderated response.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qxd9OMkCrMo
 

Quinault

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I really think that dedicated dating of one person isn't always a good idea. This idea that as soon as you start getting to know someone it should be exclusive is just unwise. Get to know people, leave the physical aspect out COMPLETELY and dating multiple people is good and healthy (as long as everyone knows that dating other people is OK). It isn't alright to be making out with Tom Tuesday, then making out with Fred Thursday. Likewise you don't want the person you are dating to be making out with Sally Wednesday and you Friday. Once dating proceeds to physical levels then it should be exclusive. But before it is physical there is no need to limit yourself to one person.
 

JamesR

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How do I find out if a woman wants children or not? I reeeeally don't want to have them, mostly due to bad experiences having to watch my siblings all the time, but I know that like 90% of women want children.
 

Quinault

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I don't think you need to be overly concerned about that right now JamesR. I don't think 90% of women want children. At least that isn't specific to the area I live in. I'd say like 50% of women want children. Once you move out and go to college you will be around a different demographic. Your desire to not have children that your baggage has baggage. I didn't ever want kids at 17 either, I have 6 now ::)

I can't get over the fact that you were born the year I was married. It makes me feel very, very old :)
 

Adela

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Don't get to caught up in looking for a specific type.  In the other thread you mentioned looking for a corporate leader/go-getter type of man.  To be honest, after working in a few large corporations and watching some of these men who are vying to move up the corporate ladder  ::) and also having a brother who quickly rose up to vice-president in a large tech company on the west coast while in his 30's, those type of men might not be what they seem.  My brother even said most of the people in executive leadership positions are all psychopaths and I sorta believe this.  There's image and then there's reality.

First you should really think about behaviors you absolutely won't accept.  In addition to the advice about seeing how he treats his mother, see how he talks about previous girlfriends.  Watch out for men who can only trash previous girlfriends as if the women were all so evil and he is a saint.  That is never reality.  Watch out for men who flatter you initially but then slowly start working in the criticisms and put-downs, etc.  Don't tolerate guys who belittle you, just get out quickly.  Watch out for guys who can't save money and are irresponsible, if you have kids you want to make sure there is money for the dentist or doctor and that you don't have to worry about where you will be living. 

Look for someone that can handle conflict well (life is full of conflict, from dealing with irrational people to situations where everything breaks at once.) Look for someone where you feel serene and comfortable, and where everything is easygoing in spite of some differences.  This is what I've found with my husband of 1 year.  We've  have some conflict but it gets quickly resolved back to where we are joking and laughing with each other.  If you can find someone who you enjoy being with, who acts in your best interest just as you act in his best interest, it doesn't matter what profession he has or what type of guy he is.  Then you will be a team and have a life partner.

This song by Louis Jordan (who started the Jump Blues) is rather funny.  It basically says to look for a mellow kind of creature who wants to call a preacher.  :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xybR9HXFZJA



 

TheTrisagion

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Anastasia1 said:
How can I learn to distinguish shoulds in what to look for vs. optionals?
What kind of things should I look for and what is just up to me?
Mandatory:
alive
nice person
you like being around him
Takes his Christian faith seriously
humble

Optionals:
Pretty much everything else
 

katherineofdixie

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Quinault said:
I really think that dedicated dating of one person isn't always a good idea. This idea that as soon as you start getting to know someone it should be exclusive is just unwise. Get to know people, leave the physical aspect out COMPLETELY and dating multiple people is good and healthy (as long as everyone knows that dating other people is OK). It isn't alright to be making out with Tom Tuesday, then making out with Fred Thursday. Likewise you don't want the person you are dating to be making out with Sally Wednesday and you Friday. Once dating proceeds to physical levels then it should be exclusive. But before it is physical there is no need to limit yourself to one person.
+1
Excellent advice!
 

orthonorm

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yeshuaisiam said:
Look at how he treats his mothers and sisters (if applicable).

When you decide, remember that this man will be your head, and you'll be submitting to him.   If he treats his mother well, he could very likely treat you well.   Take into consideration the headship order, and if you can trust him, you'll grow strong in a Christian relationship.
You sweet talker!
 

orthonorm

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katherineofdixie said:
Quinault said:
I really think that dedicated dating of one person isn't always a good idea. This idea that as soon as you start getting to know someone it should be exclusive is just unwise. Get to know people, leave the physical aspect out COMPLETELY and dating multiple people is good and healthy (as long as everyone knows that dating other people is OK). It isn't alright to be making out with Tom Tuesday, then making out with Fred Thursday. Likewise you don't want the person you are dating to be making out with Sally Wednesday and you Friday. Once dating proceeds to physical levels then it should be exclusive. But before it is physical there is no need to limit yourself to one person.
+1
Excellent advice!
People call me a monster when I suggest it.
 

orthonorm

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I once tried to have thread about this . . .

I will remain too much of a romantic, which is to say Christian. Too many people on this website elevate cultural and tribal norms along with their wounds above the notion of a blind and seemingly pathological love, which is to say true love.

Anyone who thinks love is something pleasant knows nothing of the matter beyond whatever pop song can currently let you know.

If you buy into the whole coolodox notion that God is love and heaven or hell is how you experience it, I believe I will be in hell for forever.

Love sucks.
 

orthonorm

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Quinault said:
The small things are the best things to look for;

Does he just try and be you "head" while dating? When at a restaurant, does he want to order *for you*? That sort of personality will persist and even be more pronounced in marriage. Some women like that sort of thing. That would drive me nuts.

Does he try to open doors for you? Like when getting into the car, does he unlock and open your door first, and then walk around to his side to get in? Or does he just get into the car and lean across to unlock your side? A man that always insists upon getting in first is going to insist upon being first in all things. Or he is so lazy, he doesn't want to go thru the extra effort to be a gentleman :laugh:

Is the man trying to up the physical aspect quickly? Everyone has a timeline for these things. But if a man wants to start kissing within a month of meeting, I think it is a very bad sign. A month isn't long enough to know anyone well enough to start swapping bodily fluids. The chemistry/desire can be there. But if a guy "can't help himself" when it comes to gropping you, that isn't a good sign.

How does he talk about children? Is his longing for children stronger than his desire to have a partner in life? No woman wants to be a walking womb. But it isn't a good sign if a man wants to be so much of a free spirit that he can't imagine ever settling down to have a normal life. Road life can be fun, but eventually everyone has to settle down for awhile. If his attitude is a passive- eh, I don't know? maybe I will want to settle down someday? Then he isn't mature enough for a relationship. The same would go for his attitude toward marriage. You don't want a man that is desperate to get married ASAP. If he has a sort of "whenever" attitude, that whenever may never come. Dating for decades isn't a replacement for an actual marriage. But desperation for marriage isn't a good sign either. The time when you are dating you are laying a foundation for your marriage. A man that wants to jumpstart the process has reasons for it, and they aren't always good ones. Yes, a quick marriage can be successful, but in the current society they often aren't.

How well does he deal with stress? Does he curse and freak out at every game, traffic delay or political turn? If he is "passionate" about every little thing in life, he may not be capable of discerning what is worth fighting for, and what is worth walking away from. If he is valium cool about everything then that isn't a good sign either. A man should be passionate about the things that matter; faith, family, friends. But everything else should have a moderated response.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qxd9OMkCrMo
I am mixed bag of the above which is to say a disaster.
 

orthonorm

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Fall in love Anastasia. There really is no formula.

If you are halfway sane, you will be OK. If you are not, it doesn't matter what checklists you make, you will not be.

Best of luck.
 

Quinault

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I think the #1 thing to look for is the only one that really matters:

Don't be in a relationship with someone you can't respect.

For everyone this is different. For me, it means that he has to be more intelligent than me. He can't be easily manipulated. There once was a guy so desperate to "win" me that he ate soap. Another guy almost got into a fight with a huge biker that was oggling me. I just can't respect that. Getting into a fight because someone is looking at your woman is stupid neanderthal posturing. A good man just smiles in the knowledge that he *has* her and doesn't need to defend her like property. Movies make it seem so romantic when guys fight over a girl. In real life it is embarrassing and horrifying.

I have to say that I don't think that the way a man treats his mama is the best indicator as a whole. Because if mama is emotionally manipulative, you don't want your spouse jumping at every sniffle. If he has a good mama, then he should treat her well and there should be healthy boundaries (often reinforced by a good dad). A good man loves his mama, but he isn't still tied to her apron strings.

Now I LOVE my son's. But if they wanted me to do their laundry for them and baby them in adulthood I would put my foot down. Failing that, my husband would put his foot down. They will likely always be my baby. It will be hard for me to stop seeing them as children I know. But a good son helps his mama see that he is a responsible adult and wants to be treated as such. Many a woman has hated the fact that her husband is a mama's boy. And that has led to plenty of unhappy marriages.

Second to respect; a man that can cook/shop/do his own laundry is an absolute keeper. My husband is the absolute master of all things circular and fried ;D

My sons will be in high demand. They will *all* be taught to cook, clean, shop, sew, budget properly. If any of my kids leave my house helpless to care for themselves, I didn't do my job as a mom properly. They may not be experts in every area. But they will all know how to have the skills to take care of themselves. I was absolutely horrified when I taught a cooking class at a Jr high. None of the kids knew how to so much as crack an egg, let alone whip some heavy cream into whipped cream. Really, the best whipped cream doesn't come from a tub/can so these kids were missing out!
 

PeterTheAleut

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yeshuaisiam said:
Look at how he treats his mothers and sisters (if applicable).

When you decide, remember that this man will be your head, and you'll be submitting to him.   If he treats his mother well, he could very likely treat you well.   Take into consideration the headship order, and if you can trust him, you'll grow strong in a Christian relationship.
How is this advice Orthodox?
 

Hiwot

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Quinault,Adela you women are awesome! Adela thanks for the song ;D



yeshua, the headship order and its submissive....really? lol



 
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