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Disputed Voting Turns Church, a Kremlin Ally, Into Its Critic

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Disputed Voting Turns Church, a Kremlin Ally, Into Its Critic

By SOPHIA KISHKOVSKY
Published: December 29, 2011

MOSCOW — Among the thousands of Russian voices raised against the Kremlin this month after parliamentary elections widely dismissed as fraudulent, perhaps the most surprising was that of Patriarch Kirill I, the leader of the Russian Orthodox Church , who defended popular protests as a “lawful negative reaction” to corruption.
 
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The criticism has grown so heated that Patriarch Kirill, keenly aware of the church’s continuing dependence on the state, has felt compelled to warn priests to watch their Internet tongues, saying, “Careless and sometimes intentionally provocative statements by priests cast a shadow on all of God’s church.”
(emphasis added)

The Church should not be dependent on the State. The Government of Russia is a secular Government, and the Church should stay out of the Government's business. The Church has been hurt in the past by getting involved with the Tsar's and the Communists. One would think by now they would have learned their lesson, and would appreciate the separation of Church and State.

Let the Church worry about the salvation of the souls of Russia, and the people worry about their Government.
 

Manalive

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It is an unfortunate reality and quite sad that-- especially in Russia-- secular government and Christianity are not "compatible". There shouldn't be a loophole in the Christian message that says that Christ should be "all in all" but not the state. This Masonic view of the world, that the state and more importantly the culture are left out of Christ's saving message, is just plain wrong.

While, no, the Church shouldn't be dependant on the state, it should be there and stand up for it's Christian principles.

Yet Pravmir and the recent involvement of the church in the discussions about the elections have surprised secular Russians. Dmitri Gubin, a journalist and avowed atheist who had said the silence of the church hierarchy was leading him to regard the Russian Orthodox Church as a branch of the state, said he was “dumbfounded.”

For the first time in Russia, I got a clear religious view on a secular problem,” he wrote in Ogonyok, a newsmagazine.
 

PeterTheAleut

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HandmaidenofGod said:
The criticism has grown so heated that Patriarch Kirill, keenly aware of the church’s continuing dependence on the state, has felt compelled to warn priests to watch their Internet tongues, saying, “Careless and sometimes intentionally provocative statements by priests cast a shadow on all of God’s church.”
(emphasis added)

The Church should not be dependent on the State. The Government of Russia is a secular Government, and the Church should stay out of the Government's business. The Church has been hurt in the past by getting involved with the Tsar's and the Communists. One would think by now they would have learned their lesson, and would appreciate the separation of Church and State.

Let the Church worry about the salvation of the souls of Russia, and the people worry about their Government.
Yes, the government should stay out of the Church's business, but the Church should not stay out of government's business. The Church is called to be a prophetic voice to the world, to ALL the world and ALL its institutions, to include government. The biggest problem the Church faced in Russia during the time of the Tsars and the Communists was that she allowed government to have too much power over her internal life and, having been so eviscerated, she could not speak prophetically to the Russian people to warn them of where they were headed. By compromising with the state and not standing fast on her own principles, she allowed Russia to fall prey to Bolshevik atheism and was almost exterminated as a result.

For once, I think we're finally starting to see the Church become the prophetic voice in Russia that she largely failed to be during the time of the Tsars and Bolsheviks, and I say, "Glory be to God!"
 

Second Chance

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PeterTheAleut said:
HandmaidenofGod said:
The criticism has grown so heated that Patriarch Kirill, keenly aware of the church’s continuing dependence on the state, has felt compelled to warn priests to watch their Internet tongues, saying, “Careless and sometimes intentionally provocative statements by priests cast a shadow on all of God’s church.”
(emphasis added)

The Church should not be dependent on the State. The Government of Russia is a secular Government, and the Church should stay out of the Government's business. The Church has been hurt in the past by getting involved with the Tsar's and the Communists. One would think by now they would have learned their lesson, and would appreciate the separation of Church and State.

Let the Church worry about the salvation of the souls of Russia, and the people worry about their Government.
Yes, the government should stay out of the Church's business, but the Church should not stay out of government's business. The Church is called to be a prophetic voice to the world, to ALL the world and ALL its institutions, to include government. The biggest problem the Church faced in Russia during the time of the Tsars and the Communists was that she allowed government to have too much power over her internal life and, having been so eviscerated, she could not speak prophetically to the Russian people to warn them of where they were headed. By compromising with the state and not standing fast on her own principles, she allowed Russia to fall prey to Bolshevik atheism and was almost exterminated as a result.

For once, I think we're finally starting to see the Church become the prophetic voice in Russia that she largely failed to be during the time of the Tsars and Bolsheviks, and I say, "Glory be to God!"
Glory be to God, indeed!
 

BTRAKAS

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The government of the Russian Federation, led by Vladimir Putin, and for now, Dimitri Medvedev has been supporting the Orthodox Church, in compensation for the destruction of the Church which was conducted by the previous Communist government of the Soviet Union.  That's why I am particularly pleased that the Church has stood with the people, its faithful, against the corruption of the Putin regime.
 

BoredMeeting

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PeterTheAleut said:
For once, I think we're finally starting to see the Church become the prophetic voice in Russia that she largely failed to be during the time of the Tsars and Bolsheviks, and I say, "Glory be to God!"
Having 30,000 clergy murdered by the Bolsheviks was largely responsible for that silence.

The Soviets were very up front about it; raise your voice and we'll kill you.
 

mike

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PeterTheAleut said:
Yes, the government should stay out of the Church's business, but the Church should not stay out of government's business. The Church is called to be a prophetic voice to the world, to ALL the world and ALL its institutions, to include government.
 

Matrona

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PeterTheAleut said:
HandmaidenofGod said:
The criticism has grown so heated that Patriarch Kirill, keenly aware of the church’s continuing dependence on the state, has felt compelled to warn priests to watch their Internet tongues, saying, “Careless and sometimes intentionally provocative statements by priests cast a shadow on all of God’s church.”
(emphasis added)

The Church should not be dependent on the State. The Government of Russia is a secular Government, and the Church should stay out of the Government's business. The Church has been hurt in the past by getting involved with the Tsar's and the Communists. One would think by now they would have learned their lesson, and would appreciate the separation of Church and State.

Let the Church worry about the salvation of the souls of Russia, and the people worry about their Government.
Yes, the government should stay out of the Church's business, but the Church should not stay out of government's business. The Church is called to be a prophetic voice to the world, to ALL the world and ALL its institutions, to include government.
Exactly.  If the Church had to stay out of "government business", she would  not be able to speak up about travesties like legalized child-murder.
 
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