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Florida ROCOR Church, Monastery Clergy Defect to Constantinople

WPM

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From the United States of North America
 

ialmisry

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StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
 

StanislavU

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ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that), the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise. Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
 

IreneOlinyk

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I have been trying to find an update to this story both in Russian & English languages sources.  No luck.  Also no proof that Fr. Alexander and also his father who is also a priest joined GOARCH.
The Wikipedia article about about Fr. Alexander I think is locked-
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%90%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D1%80_(%D0%91%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8F)

The last article on the Russian site Credo Press is dated October 24th: https://credo.press/227198/
 

Ainnir

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StanislavU said:
ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that), the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise. Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
This series of posts has just now come to my attention.  Please use proper titles for all of our hierarchs, and do not use or fabricate terms to be pointed or worse, to be derisive.  This is a creeping trend that we need to stop.  The whole situation is difficult and opinions are strong, but that cannot drive us to be disrespectful of these positions and the men in them.  This should be observed throughout the site.  Refer to the RULES, and if there are further questions or comments, feel free to direct them to any of the mods. 
Thanks.  --Ainnir
 

ialmisry

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StanislavU said:
ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that), the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise. Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
It is being used against the Metropolitan of Kiev and All Ukraine, the real one, that is, Metropolian Onufriy, by Petrochenko's puppets.
Caesarodule of Moscow? Your crypto-(and maybe not so secret)Brestism is showing. Your new overlords showed theirs at Athos recently.
Given the Phanar's uncanonical acts (and the canons can be read on their face for that) there is no jurisdiction for Met. Jean to leave. He and his faithful were just dumped.
 

Katechon

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StanislavU said:
ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that), the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise. Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
Honest question: why are you not under Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk?

Title added.  --Ainnir
 

StanislavU

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Katechon said:
Honest question: why are you not under Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk?
Honest question: do you really not see how inappropriate this question is? Being an excited convert trying to be more Russian than Patr. Kirill does not entitle you to question others' faith nor Orthodoxy, brother.

It seems sometimes that some Holy Russia culture warriors successfully liberated themselves fron "chimaera of consciousness" for the higher cause. You still need to be decent human beings, guys.

Title added.  --Ainnir
 

Deacon Lance

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Katechon said:
StanislavU said:
ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that), the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise. Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
Honest question: why are you not under Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk?
That would Archbishop Sviatoslav.

Title added.  Thanks, Deacon.  --Ainnir
 

Katechon

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StanislavU said:
Katechon said:
Honest question: why are you not under Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk?
Honest question: do you really not see how inappropriate this question is? Being an excited convert trying to be more Russian than Patr. Kirill does not entitle you to question others' faith nor Orthodoxy, brother.

It seems sometimes that some Holy Russia culture warriors successfully liberated themselves fron "chimaera of consciousness" for the higher cause. You still need to be decent human beings, guys.
You neither know my motives nor are you able to judge them, this is an absolute effeminate boomer tell.
I just wonder what the structural difference between your take and the one of an Ukrainian Eastern Catholic would be? Seriously. Your arguments are the same, even refering back to the same old clichés, across the board.

Title added.  And Katechon, I'm reading this post as pretty much being an ad hom.  Those aren't allowed in the public fora, and no debate or polemics of any kind is permitted in Christian News.  Knock it off or take it somewhere else.  I'm giving you 20 points this time, because you've already received a verbal warning here.  If you'd likek to appeal this decision, you may do so via PM.
Thanks.  --Ainnir
 

SolEX01

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Looks like ROCOR "might have" released the churches and their clergy to GOARCH based on a creation of a vicarate unless the vicarate was uncanonically created.

So, the EP dismantles the exarchate for Russian tradition in Europe only to create a vicarate for Slavic tradition in the United States.

New York - On Monday, March 9, 2020, following approval of the Mother Church of Constantinople last November after the request of the Holy Eparchial Synod, His Eminence Archbishop Elpidophoros, Primate of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America and Exarch of the Ecumenical Patriarchate, announced the creation of the Vicariate for the Orthodox Christian Communities of Slavic Tradition.

....

Archbishop Elpidophoros has appointed Very Rev. Archimandrite Alexander Belya as the first Vicar of the Vicariate.
https://www.goarch.org/-/2020-03-09-vicariate-of-slavic-churches

ROCOR laicized Fr. Alexander, making him another layman who's been "rehabilitated" by the EP.

To ratify the resolution of the Spiritual Court of the Eastern American Diocese regarding the laicization of the former Archimandrite Alexander (Belya), in accordance with the determination of his ruling bishop.
https://www.eadiocese.org/news_200224_2
 

IXOYE

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SolEX01 said:
Looks like ROCOR "might have" released the churches and their clergy to GOARCH based on a creation of a vicarate unless the vicarate was uncanonically created.

So, the EP dismantles the exarchate for Russian tradition in Europe only to create a vicarate for Slavic tradition in the United States.

New York - On Monday, March 9, 2020, following approval of the Mother Church of Constantinople last November after the request of the Holy Eparchial Synod, His Eminence Archbishop Elpidophoros, Primate of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America and Exarch of the Ecumenical Patriarchate, announced the creation of the Vicariate for the Orthodox Christian Communities of Slavic Tradition.

....

Archbishop Elpidophoros has appointed Very Rev. Archimandrite Alexander Belya as the first Vicar of the Vicariate.
https://www.goarch.org/-/2020-03-09-vicariate-of-slavic-churches

ROCOR laicized Fr. Alexander, making him another layman who's been "rehabilitated" by the EP.

To ratify the resolution of the Spiritual Court of the Eastern American Diocese regarding the laicization of the former Archimandrite Alexander (Belya), in accordance with the determination of his ruling bishop.
https://www.eadiocese.org/news_200224_2
Not sure they released a hieromonk while under suspension before a canonical trial.  Instead ROCOR laicized him.
 

ICXCNIKA

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https://orthochristian.com/129182.html?fbclid=IwAR2BgDc-D3lQWjCGEjTzYwX7nUZ7PWmiB4mzH01R8j25P4WlKXj44SE-9Pk

GREEK ARCHDIOCESE CREATES SLAVIC VICARIATE WITH MULTIPLE DEFROCKED AND SUSPENDED CLERICS

Maybe the Slavic Churches need to create Greek Vicariates?
 

IXOYE

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ICXCNIKA said:
Maybe the Slavic Churches need to create Greek Vicariates?
That may become necessary.

Let us pray that all may be one.
 

Ainnir

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hecma925 said:
What does that even mean?
A prolonged, progressive, mixed reaction. 
 

ialmisry

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StanislavU said:
There are differing accounts of this on the Web, and neither side looks good. At least, it looks like Belya brothers did essentially build a thriving community, and there did not seem to be sufficient grounds for the Bishop to mess with it. Anyhoo, we do not know enough to really tell what's going on.

Different question: seeing how MP just accepted clerics of the former Rue Daru Exarchate, what exactly are their objections *IF* EP *did* accept these guys (to be clear: I seriously doubt they did)? Pot, meet kettle.
A Ukrainian ladle to Phanariot slop.

Not even the Phanar claims that Rue Daru did anything wrong.
 

ialmisry

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StanislavU said:
ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that),
there is every reason to do that.
StanislavU said:
the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise.
Not applicable here. Rue Daru didn't leave its jurisdiction. It was uncanonically abolished.
StanislavU said:
Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
You mean the champion of Orthodoxy? Not canonically. But then that didn't stop the Caeserodule of Kiev-whose Caesar lost the election-nor the Caeserodule of the Phanar-whose Islamist Caesar hides behind an alien secular nationalism, and whose master Caesar in DC is equally hostile to Orthodoxy-to do as they pleased, leaving behind a putrid pile of rotten fruit.
 

ialmisry

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ICXCNIKA said:
https://orthochristian.com/129182.html?fbclid=IwAR2BgDc-D3lQWjCGEjTzYwX7nUZ7PWmiB4mzH01R8j25P4WlKXj44SE-9Pk

GREEK ARCHDIOCESE CREATES SLAVIC VICARIATE WITH MULTIPLE DEFROCKED AND SUSPENDED CLERICS

Maybe the Slavic Churches need to create Greek Vicariates?
Perhaps take the Old Calendarists under their wing.
 

Ainnir

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ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
ialmisry said:
StanislavU said:
Hawkeye said:
Schism is not simply an administrative issue. The Goldenmouth thought it no less an evil than heresy.
Again, Met. Jean trying to lead part of the former Exarchate into the MP somehow doesn't make anyone doubt their prayers reach God.
Given the Ethnarch of the Phanar's uncanonical acts in the exarchate, why would anyone doubt them?
Even assuming your reading of the relevant canons is correct (and there is no reason to do that),
there is every reason to do that.
StanislavU said:
the idea that you can leave your jurisdiction (and try to drag people and buildings with you" the minute someone makes one step outside canons is a solid idea with much promise.
Not applicable here. Rue Daru didn't leave its jurisdiction. It was uncanonically abolished.
StanislavU said:
Anyone seriously thinks it can't be used against the Caeserodule of Moscow, hmmm?
You mean the champion of Orthodoxy? Not canonically. But then that didn't stop the Caeserodule of Kiev-whose Caesar lost the election-nor the Caeserodule of the Phanar-whose Islamist Caesar hides behind an alien secular nationalism, and whose master Caesar in DC is equally hostile to Orthodoxy-to do as they pleased, leaving behind a putrid pile of rotten fruit.
isalmisry, take it down a notch or two; you're getting into both politics and polemics.  If you feel the subject requires such a response and that's the direction you want to take it, just start a thread in Politics. 
Thanks.  --Ainnir
 

hecma925

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Well, it is official since they have the slavonic.org domain name for the Slavic Orthodox Vicariate.
 

Saxon

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When doing prostrations are they squatting Slavonics?
 
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