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Folk Liturgy

Robb

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Has there ever been a known instance of DL which used guitars or folk instruments?  I know that we have this from time to time in the RCC, especially in the late 60's or 70's.  I'm sure that many purist Orthodox would object to even the use of an organ in Church, but the fact remains that organs are used by many mainstream EO parishes in America. I suspect that there may also have been a folk liturgy celebrated somewhere from time to time?
 

mike

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I can't imagine such a thing and I really doubt it.
 

LBK

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Impossible. Heck, even the occasional use of modern Russian or modern Greek as a liturgical language has been swiftly dealt with by the hierarchy of the respective local churches. (though, OTOH, modern Serbian can now be used as an alternative to Church Slavonic in Serbian jurisdictions).

Not only canonically impossible, but it simply wouldn't work. The music, be it Byzantine monody or Slavic polyphony, is composed with only the voice in mind. Adding musical instruments would be unnecessary, and it just wouldn't sound right. As for a "folk" liturgy, where the gravitas and majesty is replaced with a feel-good approach .... ewwwwww.  :p :p :p
 

synLeszka

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Hmm, I remember watching a video of Bosnian Muslims desecrating a Serbian crkva, and somehow out of behind the iconastas they pulled out a folk guitar.
I thought that the use of the guitar is common in the Orthodox liturgy of the Balkans.
 

LBK

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I thought that the use of the guitar is common in the Orthodox liturgy of the Balkans.
Stashko! Stashko, where are you?  :laugh: :laugh:
 

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synLeszka said:
Hmm, I remember watching a video of Bosnian Muslims desecrating a Serbian crkva, and somehow out of behind the iconastas they pulled out a folk guitar.
I thought that the use of the guitar is common in the Orthodox liturgy of the Balkans.
I am assuming that this is the video in question: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ktx3TNZk5g

I've attended quite a few Liturgies in Bulgaria and Serbia over the past few years, and have yet to see a guitar being used..
 

ialmisry

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synLeszka said:
Hmm, I remember watching a video of Bosnian Muslims desecrating a Serbian crkva, and somehow out of behind the iconastas they pulled out a folk guitar.
I thought that the use of the guitar is common in the Orthodox liturgy of the Balkans.
You thought wrong. What a surpires. ::)
 

synLeszka

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If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
 

ialmisry

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synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Not part of folk religion, so not apropos to the thread. But for starters, neither Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit nor the Mother of God are an "energy."  You leaning New Age, SL?

Btw, it's not a "a Serbian crkva," it's a Serbian Church.
 

synLeszka

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ialmisry said:
synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Not part of folk religion, so not apropos to the thread. But for starters, neither Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit nor the Mother of God are an "energy."  You leaning New Age, SL?

Btw, it's not a "a Serbian crkva," it's a Serbian Church.
The Holy Wisdom is part of Russian folk religion. So within the boundaries.
 

ialmisry

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synLeszka said:
ialmisry said:
synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Not part of folk religion, so not apropos to the thread. But for starters, neither Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit nor the Mother of God are an "energy."  You leaning New Age, SL?

Btw, it's not a "a Serbian crkva," it's a Serbian Church.
The Holy Wisdom is part of Russian folk religion. So within the boundaries.
and I should take the word of an Ultramontanist Pole about Russian folk religion why?
 

Dart

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synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Hagia Sophia = Holy Wisdom
Perfect wisdom is found in God alone. So the Hagia Sophia would be a characteristic of the Holy Trinity and is given to the Church by the grace of God through the Holy Spirit. This Orthodox view is different from the Roman Catholic idea of the Magisterium in which the Pope has infallible and thus perfect wisdom in interpreting the faith.

At least this is my understanding. How do you see it?
 

synLeszka

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Dart said:
synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Hagia Sophia = Holy Wisdom
Perfect wisdom is found in God alone. So the Hagia Sophia would be a characteristic of the Holy Trinity and is given to the Church by the grace of God through the Holy Spirit. This Orthodox view is different from the Roman Catholic idea of the Magisterium in which the Pope has infallible and thus perfect wisdom in interpreting the faith.

At least this is my understanding. How do you see it?
I asked because Fr.Florenski seems to not know what the Holy Wisdom is in Orthodoxy. I remember him saying that the Holy Wisdom was by some even considered St.Nicholas.
 
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synLeszka said:
Dart said:
synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Hagia Sophia = Holy Wisdom
Perfect wisdom is found in God alone. So the Hagia Sophia would be a characteristic of the Holy Trinity and is given to the Church by the grace of God through the Holy Spirit. This Orthodox view is different from the Roman Catholic idea of the Magisterium in which the Pope has infallible and thus perfect wisdom in interpreting the faith.

At least this is my understanding. How do you see it?
I asked because Fr.Florenski seems to not know what the Holy Wisdom is in Orthodoxy. I remember him saying that the Holy Wisdom was by some even considered St.Nicholas.
What does any of this have to do with the OP?
 

Dart

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synLeszka said:
Dart said:
synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Hagia Sophia = Holy Wisdom
Perfect wisdom is found in God alone. So the Hagia Sophia would be a characteristic of the Holy Trinity and is given to the Church by the grace of God through the Holy Spirit. This Orthodox view is different from the Roman Catholic idea of the Magisterium in which the Pope has infallible and thus perfect wisdom in interpreting the faith.

At least this is my understanding. How do you see it?
I asked because Fr.Florenski seems to not know what the Holy Wisdom is in Orthodoxy. I remember him saying that the Holy Wisdom was by some even considered St.Nicholas.
There were some novel ideas in early 20th century Russia which the Moscow Patriarch deemed heresy but I am not exactly sure what you are referring to. Do you mean Father Pavel Florensky or Father Georges Florensky?
 

Matrona

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Dart said:
synLeszka said:
Dart said:
synLeszka said:
If you think you are so smart Isa, 
is the Hagia Sophia, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Mother of God or some other energy?
Hagia Sophia = Holy Wisdom
Perfect wisdom is found in God alone. So the Hagia Sophia would be a characteristic of the Holy Trinity and is given to the Church by the grace of God through the Holy Spirit. This Orthodox view is different from the Roman Catholic idea of the Magisterium in which the Pope has infallible and thus perfect wisdom in interpreting the faith.

At least this is my understanding. How do you see it?
I asked because Fr.Florenski seems to not know what the Holy Wisdom is in Orthodoxy. I remember him saying that the Holy Wisdom was by some even considered St.Nicholas.
There were some novel ideas in early 20th century Russia which the Moscow Patriarch deemed heresy but I am not exactly sure what you are referring to. Do you mean Father Pavel Florensky or Father Georges Florensky?
That should be Fr. Georges FlorOVsky.
 

SubdeaconDavid

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LBK said:
Impossible. Heck, even the occasional use of modern Russian or modern Greek as a liturgical language has been swiftly dealt with by the hierarchy of the respective local churches. (though, OTOH, modern Serbian can now be used as an alternative to Church Slavonic in Serbian jurisdictions).

Not only canonically impossible, but it simply wouldn't work. The music, be it Byzantine monody or Slavic polyphony, is composed with only the voice in mind. Adding musical instruments would be unnecessary, and it just wouldn't sound right. As for a "folk" liturgy, where the gravitas and majesty is replaced with a feel-good approach .... ewwwwww.  :p :p :p
Well the use of electric organs in Greek churches in the US is about as folksy as you can get.  Can anyone say why such a modernist copying of American Protestantism got episcopal blessing? The faithful corralled into pews so that they cannot venerate an icon, light a candle or make a prostration... still they can enjoy the concert from the organ.
 
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