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Fr. Mark Arey Laicized

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Through a bit of an effort I, having read a rumor of Fr. Mark's laicizing, managed to find confirmation of it by typing his name in at the top right search engine of the Greek Archdiocese's website.  Under the hits is a January 2014 PDF file put out by the Archdiocese which confirms his being laicized.  If you simply type his name into Google you will not find any of this.  

Fr. Mark served as Director of the Office of Inter-Orthodox, Ecumenical and Interfaith Relations for the Greek Archdiocese from 2007 until recently.  I enjoyed his interviews on the Ecumenical Assembly in this country, and wonder what has happened.  I am not looking for salacious details, but am somewhat puzzled that a priest of such stature's laicization has flown under the radar.
 

podkarpatska

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Wow, he was the Archbishop's right hand man. Anytime I met the Archbishop, Father Mark was there next to him. Last time I saw him was in May at a funeral of a priest in New Jersey. I wish him well.
 

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He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
 

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ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
 

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Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
 

podkarpatska

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Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If that is the case, I hope that the church can find a role for his many talents. I know that other laicized priests have gone on to serve the Church in other positive capacities.
 

DeniseDenise

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oooh....lets all wildly speculate...



Maybe he is going to go into holistic medicine.....or wants the space aliens to come fetch him...


Point being...no one knows... :laugh:
 

Mor Ephrem

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pensateomnia said:
I've been told he wants to get married.
If that's true, I wish him well.  I met him a couple of times and was always impressed.  He is a good man. 
 

ialmisry

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podkarpatska said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
No need to be snarky.
Snarky?  What snark, and to whom?
 

scamandrius

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Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
 

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scamandrius said:
Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
This was my immediate reaction. At least under Antioch in N. America, as soon as a Priest makes known he will be divorced, he is laicized. Now, there have been a few exceptions (such as the wife wanting a divorce and the husband not).
 

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scamandrius said:
Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
A priest who becomes divorced is not necessarily impeded from continuing his priestly ministry, with the permission of his bishop, in light of the circumstances of the divorce. But, a priest who becomes divorced and desires to date, is required to be unfrocked, or laicized as we say when it is requested. It is dating and remarriage that are prohibited to the priests; (consistent with the purpose of the canon that requires a man who intends to be a married priest, to marry prior to ordination).
 

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This is an Episcopalian priest, right?  I don't think that the rules in the Episcopalian church/Anglican communion regarding priests who divorce and remarry are the same as they are in the Orthodox Church.
 

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Sakeneko said:
This is an Episcopalian priest, right?  I don't think that the rules in the Episcopalian church/Anglican communion regarding priests who divorce and remarry are the same as they are in the Orthodox Church.
No, according to the OP he's part of the Greek Archdiocese.
 

podkarpatska

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Basil 320 said:
scamandrius said:
Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
A priest who becomes divorced is not necessarily impeded from continuing his priestly ministry, with the permission of his bishop, in light of the circumstances of the divorce. But, a priest who becomes divorced and desires to date, is required to be unfrocked, or laicized as we say when it is requested. It is dating and remarriage that are prohibited to the priests; (consistent with the purpose of the canon that requires a man who intends to be a married priest, to marry prior to ordination).
That^is how it has been handled in my knowledge, with one caveat. If the divorce was a result of infidelity or spousal abuse on the part of the priest, that is handled differently and such priests are to be deposed.
 

podkarpatska

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Nephi said:
Sakeneko said:
This is an Episcopalian priest, right?  I don't think that the rules in the Episcopalian church/Anglican communion regarding priests who divorce and remarry are the same as they are in the Orthodox Church.
No, according to the OP he's part of the Greek Archdiocese.
He was the longtime Chancellor of the Archdiocese and Administrative Assistant to His Eminence, Archbishop Demetrios.
 

Maria

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podkarpatska said:
Basil 320 said:
A priest who becomes divorced is not necessarily impeded from continuing his priestly ministry, with the permission of his bishop, in light of the circumstances of the divorce. But, a priest who becomes divorced and desires to date, is required to be unfrocked, or laicized as we say when it is requested. It is dating and remarriage that are prohibited to the priests; (consistent with the purpose of the canon that requires a man who intends to be a married priest, to marry prior to ordination).
That^is how it has been handled in my knowledge, with one caveat. If the divorce was a result of infidelity or spousal abuse on the part of the priest, that is handled differently and such priests are to be deposed.
I have known two priests who were divorced by their wives. They both prayed and begged their wives to come back, but both woman refused. One Orthodox Priest is still the parish priest where he originally served as pastor. This took great humility as most people in the parish knew about the divorce. The other became an Orthodox Bishop after taking monastic vows.
 

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podkarpatska said:
Nephi said:
Sakeneko said:
This is an Episcopalian priest, right?  I don't think that the rules in the Episcopalian church/Anglican communion regarding priests who divorce and remarry are the same as they are in the Orthodox Church.
No, according to the OP he's part of the Greek Archdiocese.
He was the longtime Chancellor of the Archdiocese and Administrative Assistant to His Eminence, Archbishop Demetrios.
Yes, Fr. Mark was an Orthodox Priest of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America. The current issue of the "Orthodox Observer" reported his "Return to Status of Laymen, upon his request," effective Jan. 14, 2014. He served Archbishop Spyridon as his Director of Archdiocesan Communications. Archbishop Demetrios appointed Fr. Mark Director of Inner Orthodox, Ecumenical, and Innerfaith Relations; he was the General Secretary of SCOBA. (Not too many of Archbishop Spyridon's inner circle were retained at the Archdiocesan Headquarters during Archbishop Demetrios' tenure, not necessarily because of His Eminence's policies, but due to conflicts with the lay and clerical leadership around him.) Fr. Mark devoted much effort to securing the NY-NJ Port Authority's permission to rebuild the St. Nicholas Church at Ground Zero, along with Bishop Andonios of Phasiane, the Archdiocesan Chancellor. Earlier in his priestly career, he was the Presiding Priest of Holy Trinity Church, Nashville, Tennessee, and later served one of the parishes in New York as well. In Nashville, the small parish grew to a mid-sized parish, converts accounting for at least half of the parish membership, who were not spouses of existing members. It was during his tenure also, that the current beautiful Byzantine style church was designed.
 

Maria

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Basil 320 said:
podkarpatska said:
Nephi said:
Sakeneko said:
This is an Episcopalian priest, right?  I don't think that the rules in the Episcopalian church/Anglican communion regarding priests who divorce and remarry are the same as they are in the Orthodox Church.
No, according to the OP he's part of the Greek Archdiocese.
He was the longtime Chancellor of the Archdiocese and Administrative Assistant to His Eminence, Archbishop Demetrios.
Yes, Fr. Mark was an Orthodox Priest of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America. He served Archbishop Spyridon as his Director of Archdiocesan Communications. Archbishop Demetrios appointed Fr. Mark Director of Inner Orthodox, Ecumenical, and Innerfaith Relations; he was the General Secretary of SCOBA. (Not too many of Archbishop Spyridon's inner circle were retained at the Archdiocesan Headquarters during Archbishop Demetrios' tenure, not necessarily because of His Eminence's policies, but due to conflicts with the lay and clerical leadership around him.) Fr. Mark devoted much effort to securing the NY-NJ Port Authority's permission to rebuild the St. Nicholas Church at Ground Zero, along with Bishop Andonios of Phasiane, the Archdiocesan Chancellor. Earlier in his priestly career, he was the Presiding Priest of Holy Trinity Church, Nashville, Tennessee, and later served one of the parishes in New York as well.
What a loss. Lord have mercy.
 

SolEX01

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I was at Father Mark's ordination to the Orthodox priesthood as a 5 year old Sunday school student.  Lord have mercy.  :(
 

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DeniseDenise said:
oooh....lets all wildly speculate...



Maybe he is going to go into holistic medicine.....or wants the space aliens to come fetch him...


Point being...no one knows... :laugh:
I NEVER speculate without having some basis of information.
 

DeniseDenise

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Basil 320 said:
DeniseDenise said:
oooh....lets all wildly speculate...



Maybe he is going to go into holistic medicine.....or wants the space aliens to come fetch him...


Point being...no one knows... :laugh:
I NEVER speculate without having some basis of information.
I know.  But man, you all gossip worse then women.    :laugh:
 

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scamandrius said:
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
It all depends on the circumstances of the divorce, and, to some degree, the regulations of the local Church. If the bishop/ecclesiastical court determines the priest himself was at fault, then he would be laicized (e.g. if he committed adultery). But if he was not at fault, he made significant attempts at reconciliation, and he intends going forward to serve in celibacy, then it is not unusual for his priesthood to continue. In like manner, if a layperson is not at fault, he or she is not sanctioned; but if he or she is determined to be at fault, then excommunication is likely. Deposition for a clergyman is considered the canonical equivelent of excommunication for a layman.

There are divorced priests in every church. Dozens here in America, across all jurisdictions, since we are small; hundreds in larger churches. Some churches are more lenient than others. Romania has the most, by a margin outstripping its large size in absolute numbers.
 

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pensateomnia said:
scamandrius said:
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
It all depends on the circumstances of the divorce, and, to some degree, the regulations of the local Church. If the bishop/ecclesiastical court determines the priest himself was at fault, then he would be laicized (e.g. if he committed adultery). But if he was not at fault, he made significant attempts at reconciliation, and he intends going forward to serve in celibacy, then it is not unusual for his priesthood to continue. In like manner, if a layperson is not at fault, he or she is not sanctioned; but if he or she is determined to be at fault, then excommunication is likely. Deposition for a clergyman is considered the canonical equivelent of excommunication for a layman.

There are divorced priests in every church. Dozens here in America, across all jurisdictions, since we are small; hundreds in larger churches. Some churches are more lenient than others. Romania has the most, by a margin outstripping its large size in absolute numbers.
some seem to be forgetting that until recently a divorced patriarch led the largest Orthodox Church.
 

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Fr. Mark chrismated me on his first tenure in Nashville. Knowing the different phases of Fr. Mark tah I have seen over the years, I'm pretty sure this situation is because he wants to get married. His first wife lost total interest in being a khouriya and it was obvious to the parish. He also started getting pretty extreme in his views at the same time - a toxic mix with marital problems and being a priest. He was furious when Met. PHILIP came to town to receive St. Ignatius parish and clergy into the Antiochian Archdiocese (they were EOC). He publicly said that the visit was un canonical, that the Metropolitan be defrocked, he wouldn't commune anyone from that parish, and forbade us to visit. That's where I got off the train and changed parishes.

He soon left and got rehabilitated, I guess. Somehow his marriage went away or got annulled - something was done so he could still serve. He moderated quite a bit and I met his again a few times over the years and was not the hothead he was before. Really nice guy. But I never seem to be amazed to see the different recreations of himself. Who knows, we may see him as a priest again later on.
 

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ialmisry said:
pensateomnia said:
scamandrius said:
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
It all depends on the circumstances of the divorce, and, to some degree, the regulations of the local Church. If the bishop/ecclesiastical court determines the priest himself was at fault, then he would be laicized (e.g. if he committed adultery). But if he was not at fault, he made significant attempts at reconciliation, and he intends going forward to serve in celibacy, then it is not unusual for his priesthood to continue. In like manner, if a layperson is not at fault, he or she is not sanctioned; but if he or she is determined to be at fault, then excommunication is likely. Deposition for a clergyman is considered the canonical equivelent of excommunication for a layman.

There are divorced priests in every church. Dozens here in America, across all jurisdictions, since we are small; hundreds in larger churches. Some churches are more lenient than others. Romania has the most, by a margin outstripping its large size in absolute numbers.
some seem to be forgetting that until recently a divorced patriarch led the largest Orthodox Church.
As was the former head of the Czech church , iirc.
 

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Once a man voluntarily sheds the priesthood, he can never put it back on again, correct?

I'm of the mind that if given the privilege, you should hold on to it as tightly as possible. Then again, I've never met a priest.

Lord have mercy.
 

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Hawkeye said:
Once a man voluntarily sheds the priesthood, he can never put it back on again, correct?
He can't assume it again, but I suppose he could be reinstated.  It's exceedingly rare, but I don't think it's absolutely unheard of ever. 

I'm of the mind that if given the privilege, you should hold on to it as tightly as possible. Then again, I've never met a priest.
If you'd caught me on the right day, I'd be tempted to explain just how lucky you are.  :p  But Sunday always reminds me how grateful we should be for our priests, through whom we receive the Eucharist for the forgiveness of our sins. 
 

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Reader KevinAndrew said:
He publicly said that the visit was un canonical, that the Metropolitan be defrocked, he wouldn't commune anyone from that parish, and forbade us to visit.
Interesting.  And this was the chancellor or whatever for ACOBNCA.
 

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ialmisry said:
Reader KevinAndrew said:
He publicly said that the visit was un canonical, that the Metropolitan be defrocked, he wouldn't commune anyone from that parish, and forbade us to visit.
Interesting.  And this was the chancellor or whatever for ACOBNCA.
Well, he was a bit extreme on some views back then. ROCOOR type extreme. He took it as a compliment when Bishop TIMOTHY ( the Goarch bishop for the diocese Nashville was in) chastised him for being an extremist. But we all mellow as we age. And I guess he says and does what he has to being in the later high positions he was in. I can say that knowing him then as my pastor and seeing him in these later years, I really wasn't sure what to think of his views. But the Church gave him a break after his divorce and he effectively used that for good and did a great service in the last part if his ministry. He's a good guy and I'm sure he will find a niche to serve further.
 

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scamandrius said:
Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
It all depends on the circumstances of the divorce. It is very rare, but I have heard of divorced priests being allowed to continue to serve. Of course, they cannot get remarried and remain a Priest.

Fr. John W. Morris
 

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Reader KevinAndrew said:
He publicly said that the visit was un canonical, that the Metropolitan be defrocked, he wouldn't commune anyone from that parish, and forbade us to visit.
A good priest is never good enough, but an armchair canonist is a joy forever.
 

scamandrius

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frjohnmorris said:
scamandrius said:
Basil 320 said:
Aristobolus said:
ialmisry said:
He had said that if the Chambessy Scheme (my words, not his) turned out to be a farce, he was "outta here."

Perhaps he is just being a man of his word, since Met. Savvas let the cat out of the bag.
It is one thing to distance onself from the current efforts of the Episcopal Assembly; it is another to be laicized.  He was a Priest for I believe over thirty years.  What happened?
I don't know the circumstances of Fr. Mark's request to be laicized, of whom I have the greatest respect, but I'm sure it has nothing to do with the Episcopal Assembly process.

Fr. Mark has been divorced for many years, during the first of two successful pastorates at the wonderful Holy Trinity Church in Nashville, Tennessee, a medium sized parish that hosted a national Clergy-Laity Congress a few years ago, during his second pastorate there. Perhaps he is planning on remarrying.
If he was divorced, why wouldn't he have been laicizied immediately?  I seem to get contradictory answers when I have asked what happens to a priest if he is divorced.
It all depends on the circumstances of the divorce. It is very rare, but I have heard of divorced priests being allowed to continue to serve. Of course, they cannot get remarried and remain a Priest.

Fr. John W. Morris
I have heard though, from a priest (though not in this situation), that a priest who is widowed or divorced and has kids may remarry for the sake of his kids having a mother.  Again, I seem to get a lot of contradictory answers when it comes to this matter.
 
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