Learning Romanian on Duolingo

augustin717

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You can usually omit the pronoun/subject. The verb ending already contains it. Wen used, the personal pronoun in the  nominative  ionly adds emphasis.
 

FinnJames

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You might want to check out this site if you don't already know it. The material is free, but there are no sound files. The material seems to have been put together with EU funding for a course for immigrants.
http://www.vorbitiromaneste.ro/

Unlike the above, this costs something and was developed by a private language school. But I found it a very easy textbook, workbook and set of sound files to work with on my own:
http://rolang.ro/learn-romanian-manual.php
 

RaphaCam

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augustin717 said:
You can usually omit the pronoun/subject. The verb ending already contains it. Wen used, the personal pronoun in the  nominative  ionly adds emphasis.
Thanks, I was already wondering that. I had realised Romanian was pro-drop like Portuguese or Spanish, but in these languages dropping pronouns or keeping them doesn't really add ant emphasis.  Specially in Brazilian Portuguese for some reason (strange since Old Tupi was more pro-drop than any European language I know).
 

RaphaCam

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FinnJames said:
You might want to check out this site if you don't already know it. The material is free, but there are no sound files. The material seems to have been put together with EU funding for a course for immigrants.
http://www.vorbitiromaneste.ro/

Unlike the above, this costs something and was developed by a private language school. But I found it a very easy textbook, workbook and set of sound files to work with on my own:
http://rolang.ro/learn-romanian-manual.php
Thanks, man! I'll look into those after finishing Duolingo, which is only good for a loose knowledge of the basics, although very good for that.
 

WPM

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qauz-zeo-te totecul'
 

WPM

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RaphaCam said:
Any tips? Mulțumesc! Eu iubesc limba, foarte frumoasă.
I am learning language too.
 

Saxon

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I'm trying to learn Romanian for a trip next year, but am finding the lack of resources an issue. I don't care for Duolingo, although it's helpful for conversational practice. Pimsleur has a set, but I like to see written material, which they don't do.
 

rakovsky

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It's interestng - I know Spanish and so when I look at Romanian, it looks somehow decipherable (Due to it's Latin roots). But when I hear Romanian, it sounds Slavonic, yet somehow not decipherable.

It's this very unusual island of Romance surrounded by Slavic and Uralic/Central Asian.
 

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rakovsky said:
It's interestng - I know Spanish and so when I look at Romanian, it looks somehow decipherable (Due to it's Latin roots). But when I hear Romanian, it sounds Slavonic, yet somehow not decipherable.

It's this very unusual island of Romance surrounded by Slavic and Uralic/Central Asian.
Romanian was definitely already a weird language before massive Slavic influence kicked in (through immigration, foreign politics and Church). It arose from a Vulgar Latin dialect completely different from the ones that generated all other major Latin languages (Portuguese, Spanish, French and neighbouring languages have a common root, Italian has another, yet much closer to the former than to Romanian's root). Also, there may have been particularly strong Dacian influence in Romanian, although maybe weaker than, say, Frankish influence in French.
 

rakovsky

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Apparently in medieval times they still spoke some kind of East Romance language in what is now Yugoslavia and Croatia, so originally it was not this unique island.
 

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rakovsky said:
Apparently in medieval times they still spoke some kind of East Romance language in what is now Yugoslavia and Croatia, so originally it was not this unique island.
You mean Dalmatian, it actually had a common root with Italian, probably just like Istriot, which is still residually spoken in Croatia. Romanian isn't totally an island because there are other properly Balkanic Romance languages, most notably Vlach, but they're all small and tend to be considered Romanian varieties, even though mutual intelligibility and cultural bonds are very low. But if you considered these languages just Romanian, so Romanian is isolate.

Wikipedia claims the dialect of Castelmezzano, Italy, has a common root with Romanian, but that's not quite true. The thing is very early Vulgar Latin had 9 vowels ("a" + two forms each of "e/i/o/u"). In Sicily, Calabria and Sardinia, both forms of "i/u" merged, while in the rest of the Romance-speaking world (apart from the Balkans) one form of "i/u" respectively merged with one form of "e/o", keeping a distinction otherwise. The Balkans split "i" and merged "u". In Castelmezzano, which is quite near Calabria, the same happened. But it's much easier to explain it through simple contact.

However, English Wikipedia is a very toxic environment, so I never correct stuff there.
 

Alin

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I'm a native speaker, if you need to know anything you can ask me anytime. (I know I'm a bit late for the topic)  :D
 

FinnJames

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Alin said:
I'm a native speaker, if you need to know anything you can ask me anytime. (I know I'm a bit late for the topic)  :D
How similar is the liturgical Romanian used in church services to the contemporary written and spoken Romanian that one uses in daily life?
 

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FinnJames said:
How similar is the liturgical Romanian used in church services to the contemporary written and spoken Romanian that one uses in daily life?
It is pretty much the same, the only word that comes to mind is "Doamne, miluieşte" which mean "Lord, have mercy", for "have mercy" we usually use "Ai milă" in our daily lives, but  I think "milă" comes from "miluieşte", it is a different way of forming it mostly used in the church.
And in the prayer "Our Father" in this line " and forgive us our sins as we forgive those who sin against us;"  "și ne iartă nouă greşalele noastre, precum și noi iertăm greșiților noștri"
Sometimes we use "greşalele " (which means "mistakes" for the word sin), we normally use "greşelile ", it means the same thing. That form is usually only met in this prayer in church, I think this is the way we always said it. I hear it is a gramatically wrong form, but you will hear it in the most country churches.
Other than that it is the same.
 

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^It's not anyhow more old-fashioned than "normal" Romanian?
 

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Not really, just very few words sound somehow old fashioned, not the whole sentence or the structure, but we understand them very easily and I don't think we consider them old fashioned, maybe is just me.
Oh, a very important word we use is "bodaproste or bogdaproste " it is associated with a "thank you" to a person that did a merciful act in the name of the Lord for his or someone else's soul. I think it comes from Bulgaria.
There are words that are used for specific terms in church like in most languages that maybe some people won't know what they mean, but the words that can be used in other context are pretty common.
Some other words that I remembered and sound pretty old fashioned are "învârtoșat " mean "hardened", like in this sentence "the LORD hardened Pharaoh’s heart"-"Dar Domnul a învârtoşat inima lui Faraon" we usually say "împietrit" or "Întărit ", but in this sentence "Întărit " sound more like "strenghtened".
"Mâneca" which sounds really weird even for me, I don't even know how to translate it, without the proper accent it sounds like "sleeve" or "to eat", it means something like "Getting up early in the morning" searching God early in the morning.
There are very few, maybe in different regions of the country they use a lot more old fashioned words, but from what I heard they are all very common.
The very archaic words are hard to undestand even for me and sometimes I don't have a clue what they mean, but we don't use them anywhere.
 

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Alin said:
Oh, a very important word we use is "bodaproste or bogdaproste " it is associated with a "thank you" to a person that did a merciful act in the name of the Lord for his or someone else's soul. I think it comes from Bulgaria.
It must mean "God forgive".

I thought liturgical Romanian might be more divergent from the spoken form... But even in my church there are a lot of strange words in our liturgical texts in Portuguese, even though they were translated over the last forty years. They mostly appear in other highly formal texts, though. Just like the grammar and morphology that is so unlikely spoken Brazilian Portuguese, but very familiar in formal texts or poetry.
 

augustin717

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RaphaCam said:
rakovsky said:
Apparently in medieval times they still spoke some kind of East Romance language in what is now Yugoslavia and Croatia, so originally it was not this unique island.
You mean Dalmatian, it actually had a common root with Italian, probably just like Istriot, which is still residually spoken in Croatia. Romanian isn't totally an island because there are other properly Balkanic Romance languages, most notably Vlach, but they're all small and tend to be considered Romanian varieties, even though mutual intelligibility and cultural bonds are very low. But if you considered these languages just Romanian, so Romanian is isolate.

Wikipedia claims the dialect of Castelmezzano, Italy, has a common root with Romanian, but that's not quite true. The thing is very early Vulgar Latin had 9 vowels ("a" + two forms each of "e/i/o/u"). In Sicily, Calabria and Sardinia, both forms of "i/u" merged, while in the rest of the Romance-speaking world (apart from the Balkans) one form of "i/u" respectively merged with one form of "e/o", keeping a distinction otherwise. The Balkans split "i" and merged "u". In Castelmezzano, which is quite near Calabria, the same happened. But it's much easier to explain it through simple contact.

However, English Wikipedia is a very toxic environment, so I never correct stuff there.
two linguists, I know personally, are doing lots of in depth comparative work with  ( especially )northern italian dialects ; it’s an area of great linguistic  diversity  and it has been ignored by Romanian historical linguists so far, or they may have had a look at some city dialects but never at the villages around lake Cuomo, Piémont , Lombardia.
Romanian has lots of common vocabulary, especially words sometimes listed in dictionaries as Dacian ( btw there is no proven or provable Dacian éléments in Ro) with the Alpine dialects of Italian ( French too, sometimes) to the point where they concluded that the “Dacian” words are Celtic ; they also believe the Rom urland is in the Italian Alps and they could have not settled on the present territory before the 8-9th century.
The words that are common with Albanian it turns out are also found in Italy.
 

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Wow, very interesting. If they're really Celtic, it should be easier to find out their ultimate roots given there's so much comparative knowledge of Celtic languages. Contact between Celts and Dacians is already widely known, perhaps the Celts were more significant in this region back in the early imperial days than it was once thought. Or maybe some Celtic warlord got lucky over whatever Dacians were left once Romans were out of control, who knows.  :laugh:
 

augustin717

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RaphaCam said:
Wow, very interesting. If they're really Celtic, it should be easier to find out their ultimate roots given there's so much comparative knowledge of Celtic languages. Contact between Celts and Dacians is already widely known, perhaps the Celts were more significant in this region back in the early imperial days than it was once thought. Or maybe some Celtic warlord got lucky over whatever Dacians were left once Romans were out of control, who knows.  :laugh:
that is the thing that the Romanian ethnogenesis is almost impossible on the present territory of Romania, especially their early Christianization in Latin. So their origins should be either to the South  of the Danube or - sho knows- farther West. There Roman rule lasted longer, Latin Christianity is attested, but that makes the Dacian connexion very unlikely.
 

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augustin717 said:
RaphaCam said:
Wow, very interesting. If they're really Celtic, it should be easier to find out their ultimate roots given there's so much comparative knowledge of Celtic languages. Contact between Celts and Dacians is already widely known, perhaps the Celts were more significant in this region back in the early imperial days than it was once thought. Or maybe some Celtic warlord got lucky over whatever Dacians were left once Romans were out of control, who knows.  :laugh:
that is the thing that the Romanian ethnogenesis is almost impossible on the present territory of Romania, especially their early Christianization in Latin. So their origins should be either to the South  of the Danube or - sho knows- farther West. There Roman rule lasted longer, Latin Christianity is attested, but that makes the Dacian connexion very unlikely.
It's funny how Romanians has Latin words for vocabulary as specifically Christian as "church", "baptism" and "Pascha". The same goes for Aromanian down south.
 

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How easy is it for a native Portuguese speaker like me to learn Romanian? I'm currently learning Italian and for some reason I find Romanian easier to read than Italian.

I'm also part Romanian and I was always interested into Romania, despite Brazil having a very small Romanian immigrant community.
 

augustin717

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Romanian can’t possibly be easier to read than Italian for a Portuguese, if only for the large number of Slavic, Hungarian, Greek or Turkish loanwords.
 

RaphaCam

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Nicodemusz138 said:
How easy is it for a native Portuguese speaker like me to learn Romanian? I'm currently learning Italian and for some reason I find Romanian easier to read than Italian.
Definitely easier than for someone who doesn't speak a Romance language, but not easy. I agree with Augustin and find Italian much easier. I myself never really studied Italian, I just picked up their books and went on. That's not doable in Romanian.

I'm also part Romanian and I was always interested into Romania, despite Brazil having a very small Romanian immigrant community.
Oh, you're Brazilian too? I've met quite a few Brazilian Jews with roots in Romania, but I don't think I've ever met a Brazilian with ethnically Romanian roots.
 

ialmisry

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Alpo2 said:
^It's not anyhow more old-fashioned than "normal" Romanian?
Unlike most Orthodox, the ROC updates its texts every decade or so.
 

Alpo2

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ialmisry said:
Alpo2 said:
^It's not anyhow more old-fashioned than "normal" Romanian?
Unlike most Orthodox, the ROC updates its texts every decade or so.
We do that too. A shame really. Usually old translations are still quite understandable and sound better than new ones.
 
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