Number 1 article on "Men's Health" is a guide on "non-monogamous relationships"

reclusivus

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https://www.menshealth.com/sex-women/a27257850/non-monogamous-relationships/

I saw this on top of the site after just looking up a recipe for a protein shake. :( A site called "MEN'S HEALTH" is promoting explicit adultery and casual see and many exotic and disgusting permutations of it.

If you decide to read the whole article, be warned that you have a high chance of growing despondent or absolutely furious.

I posted this in the prayer forum because I can't handle getting depressed again over how sick our culture is. Please pray for us, although I understand if mods need to move this thread.

And I mean no hate here, but it is no coincidence to me that the author's profile is a woman with glazed dead fish-eyes who self describes as "binge-watching TV". Once you notice these things it is sickening, you can't stop; I guarantee she voluntarily has zero children and is cramped in a studio apartment with 2-3 cats/dogs. Maybe that strange icon with the angel crying away from the child watching TV isn't so hysterical after all.

I can't keep thinking about this to ruin yet another night. The desire to just become a monk far isolated from the world just keeps growing.
 

Volnutt

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It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
 

reclusivus

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Volnutt said:
It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
Uh oh, it's too late to modify my post to remove that part, I was actually going to remove it as just venting while I typed it... I promise it sounded much less antagonistic in my head. :( sorry about that. To clarify I don't hate the author  although I confess I struggle with internal anger sometimes that is not good for my health and I should pray for purification of that.

But yes you're right, I just felt like if I didn't post this here somehow I would just hyperfocus on it for a long time and get frustrated and despondent.

I wasn't actively looking to get upset, it was the #1 article on a banner while I was just trying to read something to help me tomorrow.
 

Volnutt

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reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
Uh oh, it's too late to modify my post to remove that part, I was actually going to remove it as just venting while I typed it... I promise it sounded much less antagonistic in my head. :( sorry about that. To clarify I don't hate the author  although I confess I struggle with internal anger sometimes that is not good for my health and I should pray for purification of that.

But yes you're right, I just felt like if I didn't post this here somehow I would just hyperfocus on it for a long time and get frustrated and despondent.

I wasn't actively looking to get upset, it was the #1 article on a banner while I was just trying to read something to help me tomorrow.
It's ok. I totally know how you feel. My prayers.
 

reclusivus

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Volnutt said:
reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
Uh oh, it's too late to modify my post to remove that part, I was actually going to remove it as just venting while I typed it... I promise it sounded much less antagonistic in my head. :( sorry about that. To clarify I don't hate the author  although I confess I struggle with internal anger sometimes that is not good for my health and I should pray for purification of that.

But yes you're right, I just felt like if I didn't post this here somehow I would just hyperfocus on it for a long time and get frustrated and despondent.

I wasn't actively looking to get upset, it was the #1 article on a banner while I was just trying to read something to help me tomorrow.
It's ok. I totally know how you feel. My prayers.
Thank you very much. To be honest one thing recently that set me off about this article so much is I messaged a girl that I was looking for a soulmate and true devoted love and she laughed at me for the concept. She could not believe that although she thought I was attractive, I turned down once a girl who wanted a casual "meetup". She basically called me crazy.

So when I read the article I recalled that experience and thought about the world and felt a sharp pain in my stomach. I know my mind and body reacts too much to these things but I feel like I'm carrying the weight for everyone else who is unaware of the omens - like I'm Atlas and every realization just makes it heavier and heavier.

In my generation I feel lonely.
 

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You're not alone in your observations, Reclusivus. Others have noticed and written about the trends you're seeing, including a few Christian authors.

At one point monogamy seemed like a pretty good strategy. Most people want a meaningful sexual relationship with someone, and just a few decades ago Christian marriage was an attainable way to get that. A guy would look for a girl who could keep house, and a girl would look for someone who could support her and any children they had. Girls had a strong incentive to avoid opening their legs for a guy who wouldn’t/couldn’t support a family, and guys had a strong incentive to become a provider.

Three things happened that really changed all that. One, contraception became commonplace, so people stopped having to factor the possibility of having children into their sexual choices. Two, women were given equal treatment in the workplace, allowing them to support themselves. Three, laws were established so that even if a woman had children she couldn’t support, she could be provided for by Big Brother.

Essentially, women don’t need husbands anymore, at least from an economic standpoint. And men don’t need wives, as long as they seem interesting enough to mate with. Traditional Christian marriage is left for the vanishingly small portion of society that sees celibacy or hell as the only alternatives.

The hardest part about the situation is that the only way I can think of to change the culture is to get married to a good Christian and work to be a shining example of what’s possible. Unfortunately the odds are against us.
 

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Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
 

Justin Kolodziej

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platypus said:
The hardest part about the situation is that the only way I can think of to change the culture is to get married to a good Christian and work to be a shining example of what’s possible. Unfortunately the odds are against us.
When I tried that I ended up divorced/"canonically separated". (was Catholic then, ex and kids still are.)

Really I think this is all wrong anyway. Don't try to change the culture, try to repent of sins, judge no one, and say "Thy will be done." And expect ridicule or worse.
 

Eamonomae

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biro said:
Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
Ignoring the fact that glorifying adultery as some kind of good thing goes completely against what Christ Himself literally taught (so no "Oh mah Phariseeism" bs excuse here whatsoever), you also forgot to mention the fact that men - biologically - have stronger sexual impulses than women do, and as such, have a degraded societal position of being viewed as brutes and animals who need to have sex.

And the Church requires that they get married to have sex, which is more important than what society says.
 

reclusivus

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platypus said:
You're not alone in your observations, Reclusivus. Others have noticed and written about the trends you're seeing, including a few Christian authors.

At one point monogamy seemed like a pretty good strategy. Most people want a meaningful sexual relationship with someone, and just a few decades ago Christian marriage was an attainable way to get that. A guy would look for a girl who could keep house, and a girl would look for someone who could support her and any children they had. Girls had a strong incentive to avoid opening their legs for a guy who wouldn’t/couldn’t support a family, and guys had a strong incentive to become a provider.

Three things happened that really changed all that. One, contraception became commonplace, so people stopped having to factor the possibility of having children into their sexual choices. Two, women were given equal treatment in the workplace, allowing them to support themselves. Three, laws were established so that even if a woman had children she couldn’t support, she could be provided for by Big Brother.

Essentially, women don’t need husbands anymore, at least from an economic standpoint. And men don’t need wives, as long as they seem interesting enough to mate with. Traditional Christian marriage is left for the vanishingly small portion of society that sees celibacy or hell as the only alternatives.

The hardest part about the situation is that the only way I can think of to change the culture is to get married to a good Christian and work to be a shining example of what’s possible. Unfortunately the odds are against us.
Thank you for your appreciation and glum reality, you're right but honestly I have seen more than enough of these despair-inducing things and I really would appreciate if there was any hope to look forward to :( is there any hope? Realistically right now it seems the only thing I can do is pray... but will God listen? I'm less than nothing.
 

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biro said:
Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
That’s true, although the fleeting pleasure received from a hooker doesn't do much to satisfy people’s desire for a meaningful sexual relationship.
 

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Justin Kolodziej said:
platypus said:
The hardest part about the situation is that the only way I can think of to change the culture is to get married to a good Christian and work to be a shining example of what’s possible. Unfortunately the odds are against us.
When I tried that I ended up divorced/"canonically separated". (was Catholic then, ex and kids still are.)

Really I think this is all wrong anyway. Don't try to change the culture, try to repent of sins, judge no one, and say "Thy will be done." And expect ridicule or worse.
I’m not sure that I see those two things as being at odds. Your perspective is worth a lot more, though, since you've been married.

I don’t just want to have a good marriage; I’d like it to be a realistic possibility for my friends, and -God willing- one day my children. But I understand that our salvation is more important than having a nice culture.
 

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reclusivus said:
Thank you for your appreciation and glum reality, you're right but honestly I have seen more than enough of these despair-inducing things and I really would appreciate if there was any hope to look forward to :( is there any hope? Realistically right now it seems the only thing I can do is pray... but will God listen? I'm less than nothing.
Is there hope that monogamy will become common or practical in America? I don’t think so. On the flip side, is there hope that you and I can have good marriages? I think so. And as always, we’ve got hope in eternal life. If we don't get the opportunity to have good marriages, then at least we've been given a great opportunity to struggle towards salvation. God had a reason for throwing us into this mess.

I’m in the military, where divorce is almost as inevitable. Most people can’t deal with the separation and constant opportunities to cheat. Despite this, I’ve met several military couples who have been married for more than a decade and treat each other well. Most of them were devout Mormons or Catholics.

I think being around other people who have strong marriages is immensely helpful. For example, one of my Mormon buddies had a seemingly great marriage until he moved away from Utah. Previously they were in a situation where their friends were people who valued marriage, and then they moved and developed a new social circle where his wife’s coworkers constantly offered her advice to divorce or opportunities to cheat. Then she had an affair and left him.  Had they stayed amongst the Mormons in Utah, I bet things would have turned out better.

In my hometown, divorce is almost unheard of amongst the churchgoing Roman Catholic community. It’s a social expectation that young Catholics will marry another Catholic and remain married. And the young Catholic couples are surrounded by other Catholic couples with strong marriages, reinforcing the idea that it's doable and providing them with plenty of solid role models.

There's probably an place in the US with a decent-sized Orthodox community like that.
 
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reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
Uh oh, it's too late to modify my post to remove that part, I was actually going to remove it as just venting while I typed it... I promise it sounded much less antagonistic in my head. :( sorry about that. To clarify I don't hate the author  although I confess I struggle with internal anger sometimes that is not good for my health and I should pray for purification of that.

But yes you're right, I just felt like if I didn't post this here somehow I would just hyperfocus on it for a long time and get frustrated and despondent.

I wasn't actively looking to get upset, it was the #1 article on a banner while I was just trying to read something to help me tomorrow.
It's ok. I totally know how you feel. My prayers.
Thank you very much. To be honest one thing recently that set me off about this article so much is I messaged a girl that I was looking for a soulmate and true devoted love and she laughed at me for the concept. She could not believe that although she thought I was attractive, I turned down once a girl who wanted a casual "meetup". She basically called me crazy.

So when I read the article I recalled that experience and thought about the world and felt a sharp pain in my stomach. I know my mind and body reacts too much to these things but I feel like I'm carrying the weight for everyone else who is unaware of the omens - like I'm Atlas and every realization just makes it heavier and heavier.

In my generation I feel lonely.

This is very sad. Obviously as Orthodox we believe marriage to be a sacrament for our salvation. This is the first and foremost reason for marriage. I had a discussion similar to this with two male coworkers, and I approached it from another angle. One of them was speaking of their promiscuous days as a youth. Without sounding prideful or judgmental I told them: I know where I come from. My great grandfather was a genealogist who traced my family's history all the way to the 1st Century AD. I am descended from Emperors, Saints and Kings. I know my ancestors struggled with great hardship to produce a family line. My ancestors shed their blood, sweat and tears so that I could be. As a young man I did not spread my seed to the wind. In my blood rests all of those who have come before me. They are all apart of me. When it was time to find a wife, I chose a woman who was chaste as I was. I chose a woman full of good character and righteousness. In time we began a family, and now have four sons, whom I will teach the same.I pray everyday they can withstand the onslaught of this age and remain pure. Chastity is not just for girls, but boys as well. My boys will know this, regardless of what the world teaches.
 

reclusivus

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Justinian of Narnia said:
reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
Uh oh, it's too late to modify my post to remove that part, I was actually going to remove it as just venting while I typed it... I promise it sounded much less antagonistic in my head. :( sorry about that. To clarify I don't hate the author  although I confess I struggle with internal anger sometimes that is not good for my health and I should pray for purification of that.

But yes you're right, I just felt like if I didn't post this here somehow I would just hyperfocus on it for a long time and get frustrated and despondent.

I wasn't actively looking to get upset, it was the #1 article on a banner while I was just trying to read something to help me tomorrow.
It's ok. I totally know how you feel. My prayers.
Thank you very much. To be honest one thing recently that set me off about this article so much is I messaged a girl that I was looking for a soulmate and true devoted love and she laughed at me for the concept. She could not believe that although she thought I was attractive, I turned down once a girl who wanted a casual "meetup". She basically called me crazy.

So when I read the article I recalled that experience and thought about the world and felt a sharp pain in my stomach. I know my mind and body reacts too much to these things but I feel like I'm carrying the weight for everyone else who is unaware of the omens - like I'm Atlas and every realization just makes it heavier and heavier.

In my generation I feel lonely.

This is very sad. Obviously as Orthodox we believe marriage to be a sacrament for our salvation. This is the first and foremost reason for marriage. I had a discussion similar to this with two male coworkers, and I approached it from another angle. One of them was speaking of their promiscuous days as a youth. Without sounding prideful or judgmental I told them: I know where I come from. My great grandfather was a genealogist who traced my family's history all the way to the 1st Century AD. I am descended from Emperors, Saints and Kings. I know my ancestors struggled with great hardship to produce a family line. My ancestors shed their blood, sweat and tears so that I could be. As a young man I did not spread my seed to the wind. In my blood rests all of those who have come before me. They are all apart of me. When it was time to find a wife, I chose a woman who was chaste as I was. I chose a woman full of good character and righteousness. In time we began a family, and now have four sons, whom I will teach the same.I pray everyday they can withstand the onslaught of this age and remain pure. Chastity is not just for girls, but boys as well. My boys will know this, regardless of what the world teaches.
Justinian, honestly your post flooded my mind with so many thoughts. For now, I should just say I really admire all that, and if I am not meant to be a monk or something, please pray for me that I may share in your courageous blessings. :) Your avatar is fitting, he's my favorite Emperor.
 

Tzimis

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Justinian of Narnia said:
reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
reclusivus said:
Volnutt said:
It's bad, but there have always been philanderers (especially given Jesus treating lust the same as adultery). If it's going to happen, I'd rather see it happen openly with agreements between the parties so there's a chance of it doing a little less harm in terms of hurt feelings instead of just being papered over with old school hypocrisy. We need to wash the inside of the cup so that the outside can be clean also.

You might want to ask yourself why this ruins your day that much. Are you really concerned for people's souls or, for example, is it just because it ruins your little medieval mental LARP? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just honestly asking, especially given the totally pointless divergence onto the author herself.
Uh oh, it's too late to modify my post to remove that part, I was actually going to remove it as just venting while I typed it... I promise it sounded much less antagonistic in my head. :( sorry about that. To clarify I don't hate the author  although I confess I struggle with internal anger sometimes that is not good for my health and I should pray for purification of that.

But yes you're right, I just felt like if I didn't post this here somehow I would just hyperfocus on it for a long time and get frustrated and despondent.

I wasn't actively looking to get upset, it was the #1 article on a banner while I was just trying to read something to help me tomorrow.
It's ok. I totally know how you feel. My prayers.
Thank you very much. To be honest one thing recently that set me off about this article so much is I messaged a girl that I was looking for a soulmate and true devoted love and she laughed at me for the concept. She could not believe that although she thought I was attractive, I turned down once a girl who wanted a casual "meetup". She basically called me crazy.

So when I read the article I recalled that experience and thought about the world and felt a sharp pain in my stomach. I know my mind and body reacts too much to these things but I feel like I'm carrying the weight for everyone else who is unaware of the omens - like I'm Atlas and every realization just makes it heavier and heavier.

In my generation I feel lonely.

This is very sad. Obviously as Orthodox we believe marriage to be a sacrament for our salvation. This is the first and foremost reason for marriage. I had a discussion similar to this with two male coworkers, and I approached it from another angle. One of them was speaking of their promiscuous days as a youth. Without sounding prideful or judgmental I told them: I know where I come from. My great grandfather was a genealogist who traced my family's history all the way to the 1st Century AD. I am descended from Emperors, Saints and Kings. I know my ancestors struggled with great hardship to produce a family line. My ancestors shed their blood, sweat and tears so that I could be. As a young man I did not spread my seed to the wind. In my blood rests all of those who have come before me. They are all apart of me. When it was time to find a wife, I chose a woman who was chaste as I was. I chose a woman full of good character and righteousness. In time we began a family, and now have four sons, whom I will teach the same.I pray everyday they can withstand the onslaught of this age and remain pure. Chastity is not just for girls, but boys as well. My boys will know this, regardless of what the world teaches.
Did you read about that doctor that spread his seed to thousands of in vetro fertilized women.  Try keeping registry of that.
 

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platypus said:
biro said:
Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
That’s true, although the fleeting pleasure received from a hooker doesn't do much to satisfy people’s desire for a meaningful sexual relationship.
I suppose a person can be a monogamous whoremonger.
 

Mor Ephrem

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hecma925 said:
platypus said:
biro said:
Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
That’s true, although the fleeting pleasure received from a hooker doesn't do much to satisfy people’s desire for a meaningful sexual relationship.
I suppose a person can be a monogamous whoremonger.
As long as the whore being monged is a virgin Orthodox prostitute.
 

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Mor Ephrem said:
hecma925 said:
platypus said:
biro said:
Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
That’s true, although the fleeting pleasure received from a hooker doesn't do much to satisfy people’s desire for a meaningful sexual relationship.
I suppose a person can be a monogamous whoremonger.
As long as the whore being monged is a virgin Orthodox prostitute.
That can cook.
 

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Mor Ephrem said:
biro said:
Men never really had to get married to have sex. There were always sex workers.

Women never had that option.
They could become sex workers.
Rofl.......

Ohh Mor you rascal, i choked on that
 

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Svartzorn said:
I see a lot of talking but no solution for people wanting to escape degeneracy.

Call it out, be adamant to your relatives,.coworkers, etc. Dont sit idly by and watch it all go to hell.

Its frustrating because the moment you speak out, you'll be ostracized for it, but know that this world hated Jesus, and it'll hate you too.

 
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