Raising Children in a Mixed Marriage

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
(if indeed this is a true story, which I'm not in a position to judge)
Trust me on this, it is.

Liz said:
If someone called themselves an Orthodox priest and went around doing the same, you'd surely assume he was mad and you wouldn't judge the rest of the Church by his actions.
No. But it certainly is not a confusing anomaly with respect to Anglicanism in North America; it's actually a rather logical and understandable trajectory of trends I see among Anglicans here. And it really started in England with the "all baptized Christians" policy.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
it's to do with being true to the spirit of Christ's sacrifice and his ministry, which didn't cling to the old Jewish laws restricting who could touch whom, and who could participate in what.
That reasoning is not applicable. And if it was, then non-baptized people should be allowed to partake of communion. But that is not the case; the standard policy of the Anglican Communion is to allow baptized Christians, but not anyone who is not baptized.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
I would think that, whatever difficulties we might expect in Orthodox/Anglican mixed parenting, it must be far harder for Orthodox/Catholic couples.
Actually, yes, as the Romans recognize some form of superiority of their own church over any other, which Anglicans do not.

Liz said:
Or would the Orthodox Church feel differently about this, as the Catholic  Church shares some history with the Orthodox?
Not really. Sacramentally speaking, the approach between two in a marriage wouldn't be really any different.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
No - I am sure there are no Anglicans who don't believe in the resurrection!
Well, you are welcome to deny them as legitimate Anglicans, but there certainly are plenty of Anglicans (particularly in North America) in good standing in a dioceses who deny the fleshly resurrection of Christ. I've even met a number of them and debated this topic with them.

Liz said:
It would go against the Anglican Creed, so quite impossible.
That's very naive of you. There are plenty of Anglicans who simply don't believe in various parts of the Creed.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
The Anglican Creed states, 'I believe ... in Jesus Christ ... he suffered death, and was buried. On the third day, he rose again'. There is no way around that. If you are Anglican, you profess faith in the Resurrection. Anything else, and you are not Anglican, nor Christian.
I like your attitude. Unfortunately probably the majority of the people in the Anglican Communion recognize John Spong as a legitimate Anglican and even a legitimate Anglican Bishop at that.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
If I did have children, they could not 'reject' communion, as they would be children!
We serve Communion to children from as young as possible in the East.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
deusveritasest said:
Liz said:
And how would this mysteriously make him Anglican?
From our perspective, Holy Communion is an expression of a whole, full, and integral faith. If you take Communion at a church it means either that you believe what that church teaches or that you are a hypocrite.
Yes, but surely, an outside perspective is irrelevant here?
Pardon me? I don't understand what you are meaning.
 

deusveritasest

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Liz said:
deusveritasest said:
Liz said:
I have not heard this 'story' about communion being given to a dog, but it is disrespectful to associate something like that with any religion. Please don't do so.
Well, it was not in the Church of England. But he is right that there was a scandal caused by an Anglican Communion priest serving communion to a dog.
I have responded to this before, but I will say again: this is deeply offensive, and I like it no more than you.
I think you may overestimate how offended I would be.

Edited for moratorium violation - mike.
 

deusveritasest

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As for Anglicans taking Communion in an Orthodox church, I have experienced them not being allowed in most cases, but a few weeks ago I experienced the local Armenian bishop openly welcoming an Anglican to Communion.
 

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There are two major issues that would be fairly insurmountable explaining to children. (George wouldn't have this issue since he doesn't believe that children should be taught about faith at all). The first would be the orthodox view of salvation, the second would be the orthodox view of hell. Those two issues will always be an issue, and a very confusing one at that. You can not teach that "mommy believes this and daddy believes that" without confusing the heck out of the child. Either raise the child orthodox, or raise the child Anglican. Maybe you can make it "work" for your children. But the children will grow up quite confused and may eventually become quite angry and leave all faith altogether. The issues of communion are great as well. You can not have your children partake at one church one week and another a different week. Kids don't stay little forever ;) A child would not be allowed to partake of Anglican and Orthodox Eucharists concurrently. This would place the child in a position where they will have to choose between mom and dad at some point. They will have to decide that one or the other is correct. That is not a fair position to put a child in, it simply isn't healthy. You place the child into a situation of religious divorce whether you intend to or not.
 

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At least here in my area you can not just lie to a priest to be allowed to commune. If I want to visit another parish I have to pre-arrange with my priest and the priest of the parish I am visiting in order to be allowed to partake. Our priest helps run various pan-orthodox services around the country. The priests in my area are all in quite close contact, even across jurisdictions.
 

Alveus Lacuna

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deusveritasest said:
As for Anglicans taking Communion in an Orthodox church, I have experienced them not being allowed in most cases, but a few weeks ago I experienced the local Armenian bishop openly welcoming an Anglican to Communion.
Maybe he was just ignorant of what Anglicanism is or has become.
 

ICXCNIKA

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Liz,

In 2006 the CofE allowed for children to receive the Eucharist even if they have not been confirmed. It is up to the local bishop to institute the practice in his diocese. However, once a child has been allowed to receive they may receive in any parish in the CofE even if the diocese the child is currently in has not instituted this policy. I am surprised that this is a rather new phenomenon in the UK. Quite different from what I have experienced in Anglican Communion Churches here. It is towards the bottom of the page. Also, Roman Catholic children also receive First Communion before confirmation. If I remember correctly First Confession & Communion are usually received in about the 2nd grade of primary school so they are about 8-10 years old. Confirmation at least in the diocese that I am familiar with was usually performed in 7th grade so somewhere between 12-14 years of age.

http://www.cofe.anglican.org/info/education/children/

Liz said:
deusveritasest said:
Liz said:
and I don't believe there's any reason they couldn't participate just as much as their peer-group in both services. The real issue comes after childhood, when the individual must make a decision - but then, you'd hope anyone making adult decisions about faith would do so carefully. With my partner and me, there is nothing whatsoever that would prevent a child from participating in both Orthodox and Anglican services just as fully as anyone else.
As far as I know, your partner/husband (sorry, I don't remember exactly what stage you are at in this) is essentially required by his church to forbid his children form partaking of the "Sacraments" in your own.
Children do not partake of the Sacraments in the Anglican Church; that's the point. The only one would be the christening, and an Orthodox ceremony would be as valid as an Anglican one.
 

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ICXCNIKA said:
Liz,

In 2006 the CofE allowed for children to receive the Eucharist even if they have not been confirmed. It is up to the local bishop to institute the practice in his diocese. However, once a child has been allowed to receive they may receive in any parish in the CofE even if the diocese the child is currently in has not instituted this policy. I am surprised that this is a rather new phenomenon in the UK. Quite different from what I have experienced in Anglican Communion Churches here. It is towards the bottom of the page. Also, Roman Catholic children also receive First Communion before confirmation. If I remember correctly First Confession & Communion are usually received in about the 2nd grade of primary school so they are about 8-10 years old. Confirmation at least in the diocese that I am familiar with was usually performed in 7th grade so somewhere between 12-14 years of age.
Yes, but it doesn't take genius to realize that, if you're trying to bring up a child in a mixed marriage, you simply decline the option - which was, in any case, mainly instituted to make older children feel included. Confirmation in my community usually happens 13-21. It's an unusual bishop who'd confirm a child of 8 - perhaps you are thinking of Catholic Churches?
 

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Quinault said:
There are two major issues that would be fairly insurmountable explaining to children. (George wouldn't have this issue since he doesn't believe that children should be taught about faith at all). The first would be the orthodox view of salvation, the second would be the orthodox view of hell. Those two issues will always be an issue, and a very confusing one at that. You can not teach that "mommy believes this and daddy believes that" without confusing the heck out of the child. Either raise the child orthodox, or raise the child Anglican. Maybe you can make it "work" for your children. But the children will grow up quite confused and may eventually become quite angry and leave all faith altogether. The issues of communion are great as well. You can not have your children partake at one church one week and another a different week. Kids don't stay little forever ;) A child would not be allowed to partake of Anglican and Orthodox Eucharists concurrently. This would place the child in a position where they will have to choose between mom and dad at some point. They will have to decide that one or the other is correct. That is not a fair position to put a child in, it simply isn't healthy. You place the child into a situation of religious divorce whether you intend to or not.
I just don't understand this assumption that children cannot understand two views at once. It speaks poorly of the state of education in America, perhaps, because I've never encountered problems with it here.

I suppose you are right that, if we had a child whose mental abilities were very limited, it would be unfair to put him or her in this situation, and I think then we would simply take him or her to the Orthodox Church.
 

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ICXCNIKA said:
Who is pretending? We have seen it with our own eyes. So are your children Orthodox? So they reject open communion as practised by your Church along with all the other variants that are contrary to Holy Orthodoxy?
Sorry, I don't understand what you're asking?

This thread is moving fast! I'm sorry if I'm not answering everything.
 

ICXCNIKA

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Liz,

I think you may be in a unique situation, for the short term at least. Here in the US the Episcopal Church (Anglican Province) administers communion to all baptized Christians regardless of age. It seems that the CofE is moving in that direction or else they wouldn't have instituted this policy. The problem is that if you are trying to raise your children in the Orthodox Church and then take them to an Anglican parish and other kids are receiving, which probably will become more regular, how would they feel? Will they feel pressured? I think you misread my post as I did not say that Roman's Confirm at 8 rather between 12-14 years of age (if they are properly prepared).

Liz said:
ICXCNIKA said:
Liz,

In 2006 the CofE allowed for children to receive the Eucharist even if they have not been confirmed. It is up to the local bishop to institute the practice in his diocese. However, once a child has been allowed to receive they may receive in any parish in the CofE even if the diocese the child is currently in has not instituted this policy. I am surprised that this is a rather new phenomenon in the UK. Quite different from what I have experienced in Anglican Communion Churches here. It is towards the bottom of the page. Also, Roman Catholic children also receive First Communion before confirmation. If I remember correctly First Confession & Communion are usually received in about the 2nd grade of primary school so they are about 8-10 years old. Confirmation at least in the diocese that I am familiar with was usually performed in 7th grade so somewhere between 12-14 years of age.
Yes, but it doesn't take genius to realize that, if you're trying to bring up a child in a mixed marriage, you simply decline the option - which was, in any case, mainly instituted to make older children feel included. Confirmation in my community usually happens 13-21. It's an unusual bishop who'd confirm a child of 8 - perhaps you are thinking of Catholic Churches?
 
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