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Strange icons

LBK

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Looks like people are mistaking dragon's wings for palm leaves ....
 

Deacon Lance

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Yes, but in such case somebody puting the branches is missing. Or that those rbanches had been already given unto the feet. Maybe thinking too much, but for this reason I've put this icon in this section, as I've never before seen something like this ;)
I think you are overthinking it.😉
 

brlon

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Perhaps an enquiry might be made of the supplier, UKCopticIcons.com - their website gives a contact email address.
 

Dominika

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Just a bit strange via frame and "construction"

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Dominika

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Martyrs on the road of monastery Anba Samuel the Confessor


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More about this martyrdom here
 

Dominika

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"Arius is mad and full of malice, o Peter" or something like this, monastery Someșul Cald, Romania



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Not so strange, but communists blocks are not so often in the icons

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Shanghaiski

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It is not Orthodox. It may come from some Coptic iconographer, but the depiction of Christ here is absolutely anti-traditional, dressing him in the fashion of later, anti-Christian, rabbinical Judaism.
 
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RaphaCam

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It is not Orthodox. It may come from some Coptic iconographer, but the depiction of Christ here is absolutely anti-traditional, dressing him in the fashion of later, anti-Christian, rabbinical Judaism.
The tallit and tefillin were already in use in Second Temple Judaism, as Christ mentions both Pharisees (the ancestors of Rabinnical Jews) and Sadducees (the ancestors of Karaite Jews) using them in St. Matthew 23:5. The tallit is clearly commanded in Numbers 15:38, but the commandments that Rabinnical Jews understand as commanding tefillin seem to be metaphorical, and that's how Karaite Jews see it. There were almost definitely many different sects calling themselves "Sadducees", so it's no surprise that Christ reports something that's missing from the Karaites.
 

Shanghaiski

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The tallit and tefillin were already in use in Second Temple Judaism, as Christ mentions both Pharisees (the ancestors of Rabinnical Jews) and Sadducees (the ancestors of Karaite Jews) using them in St. Matthew 23:5. The tallit is clearly commanded in Numbers 15:38, but the commandments that Rabinnical Jews understand as commanding tefillin seem to be metaphorical, and that's how Karaite Jews see it. There were almost definitely many different sects calling themselves "Sadducees", so it's no surprise that Christ reports something that's missing from the Karaites.
That is one interpretation, at least.
 
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The painting emphasizes how Jewish He is isolated from the context of the Gospel verse written on it.
 

Deacon Lance

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Matthew 23:5

5 They do all their deeds to be seen by men; for they make their phylacteries broad and their fringes long,

Deuteronomy 6:4-9

4 “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord; 5 and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. 6 And these words which I command you this day shall be upon your heart; 7 and you shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise. 8 And you shall bind them as a sign upon your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 9 And you shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.

Numbers 15:37-41

37 The Lord said to Moses, 38 “Speak to the people of Israel, and bid them to make tassels on the corners of their garments throughout their generations, and to put upon the tassel of each corner a cord of blue; 39 and it shall be to you a tassel to look upon and remember all the commandments of the Lord, to do them, not to follow after your own heart and your own eyes, which you are inclined to go after wantonly. 40 So you shall remember and do all my commandments, and be holy to your God. 41 I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: I am the Lord your God.”
 

Deacon Lance

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The painting emphasizes how Jewish He is isolated from the context of the Gospel verse written on it.
He is Jewish and would have done Jewish things like wear a prayer shawl and a phylactery when leading prayer in a Synagogue as Jewish men did. Other than the underlying antisemitism that has plagued Christianity, what is the problem with showing this?
 
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He is Jewish and would have done Jewish things like wear a prayer shawl and a phylactery when leading prayer in a Synagogue as Jewish men did. Other than the underlying antisemitism that has plagued Christianity, what is the problem with showing this?
I wrote the problem that I have. Others may not have an issue with it. It's not antisemitic to point it out. In the mid-Pentecost icons that I have seen, Christ is not shown wearing this type of clothing. If you know of an example, I'd be happy to see it.
 

Deacon Lance

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I wrote the problem that I have. Others may not have an issue with it. It's not antisemitic to point it out. In the mid-Pentecost icons that I have seen, Christ is not shown wearing this type of clothing. If you know of an example, I'd be happy to see it.
Why is it wrong to show his Jewishness?
 

Deacon Lance

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It isn't. Do you know of other icons of Christ depicting Him this way?
You said: “The painting emphasizes how Jewish He is isolated from the context of the Gospel verse written on it.” As if emphasizing his Jewish heritage was a bad thing.

Not off the top of my head, but so what? A new icon can never be developed?
 
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RaphaCam

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Not off the top of my head, but so what? A new icon can never be developed?
We would need someone with a good understanding of Coptic iconography to say if anything's wrong from their own POV, but according to my bishop, who has a bit of an iconographic background, only a bishop should approve a completely new icon, and even then only after a lot of diligence. If a Byzantine iconographer chose to replace Christ's almost universally depicted theologically meaningful clothes with imagery associated to Old Testament ritual, this might raise some questions. An icon of Christ with "corrected" clothes would be less informative than "correcting" the Pentecost icon, which depicts people who weren't there and books who weren't written yet, but we don't want to go there either.



Anyway, I can find many icons in which St. Simeon the Prophet is depicted with the phylactery, but he lacks it in many other ones. This would need to be competently researched.



 

Dominika

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I suppose it may be something with gaining again the independece after Ottoman Empire occupation, as it is a kind of resurrection (especially it was living under Islam), but, of course, not sure... Maybe it's a wishful thinking.
 
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