Strange icons

Nephi

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Mor Ephrem said:
Was it painted in Pittsburgh? 
Yeah, uh huh, you know what it is
Black and yellow, black and yellow
Black and yellow, black and yellow
 

Deacon Lance

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Yinz guys don't know nothin.  If it was painted in the God-protected Holy City of Champions the vestments would be black and gold and the the mitre would be decorated with the tri-color hypocycloids representing the Holy Trinity.  Fer cryin out loud.
 

Mor Ephrem

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Hypocycloids?  Is that really what they call them?  I lived in the area for a year and never heard that term...I never would've imagined anyone there using the word "hypocycloid".  LOL.   
 

Deacon Lance

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Mor Ephrem said:
Hypocycloids?  Is that really what they call them?  I lived in the area for a year and never heard that term...I never would've imagined anyone there using the word "hypocycloid".  LOL.   
That is the technical name for them according to US Steel who created the logo.  Most would call them the three thingies in the Steeler emblem.  :D
 

LBK

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How to ruin a perfectly good Kazanskaya:

It looks like one person painted the Mother of God, and very well, someone else painted the Child. Not sure what the second painter was on at the time ....

 

LBK

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Nephi said:


Haven't seen this kind of color scheme before with all the black and yellow
It's no wonder you haven't. Black is the one color which is completely wrong as a background. It represents death, darkness, and evil, the polar opposite of the qualities which have led to the sanctification of the holy one depicted on the icon, in this case, St Nicholas of Myra. Black is used sparingly, and in specific circumstances, such as the abyss of Hades in icons of the Resurrection, and the darkness surrounding the bearded Kosmos figure holding a basket of scrolls at the bottom of Pentecost icons.

While gold is the ideal background, as, among other things, it represents purity, incorruption and the unfading Light which comes from God, other colors may be, and are, used, mainly for reasons such as the availability of pigments in a local area, and the impracticality in many cases of providing very large areas of gold-leafed background. Novgorod icons are known for their distinctive vermilion backgrounds, Pskov icons for their sage green, etc. Deep blue is a very common choice for icons painted on church walls, across many traditions.
 

Asteriktos

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That skyline is much too impressive to be Los Angeles...
 

Alveus Lacuna

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LBK said:
Black represents death, darkness, and evil, the polar opposite of the qualities which have led to the sanctification of the holy one depicted on the icon, in this case, St Nicholas of Myra.
Which is why all clergy wear black, to show the evils of the bodies we are trapped in.
 

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Alveus Lacuna said:
LBK said:
Black represents death, darkness, and evil, the polar opposite of the qualities which have led to the sanctification of the holy one depicted on the icon, in this case, St Nicholas of Myra.
Which is why all clergy wear black, to show the evils of the bodies we are trapped in.
almost spit a mixture of polish sausage and beer on my keyboard
 

Nephi

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In that Los Angeles icon, who are the people in the center left and right? Looks like a Native American Mary on the left, but I may be wrong.
 

LBK

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LizaSymonenko said:
IIRC I commented on this image, or a segment of it, in the "Schlock icons" thread a while back.
 

LBK

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Michał Kalina said:
LBK said:
IIRC I commented on this image, or a segment of it, in the "Schlock icons" thread a while back.
IIRC it was another one LA icon.
Both paintings contain the same compositional elements, so I regard them as essentially the same.

Here's one of my posts on it:

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,47878.msg865760.html#msg865760
 

Nephi

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Not really strange but "different," and I didn't want to start a new thread altogether. Anyway, I've seen icons of this rendition of Christ around the web before, and wondered if anyone knew any more about them? The hand position makes me think it's maybe OO, IDK.

 

Mor Ephrem

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Nephi said:
Not really strange but "different," and I didn't want to start a new thread altogether. Anyway, I've seen icons of this rendition of Christ around the web before, and wondered if anyone knew any more about them? The hand position makes me think it's maybe OO, IDK.
Yeah, that looks like a Coptic version of a Greek icon.  Only the hand position gives it away as Coptic (e.g., the vestments are definitely Greek and not Coptic). 
 

LizaSymonenko

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I've never seen this one before.

It was entitled "Love".



It could be misleading to the casual onlooker, who doesn't know to read the letters identifying the Theotokos.
 

LBK

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LizaSymonenko said:
I've never seen this one before.

It was entitled "Love".



It could be misleading to the casual onlooker, who doesn't know to read the letters identifying the Theotokos.
It is a copy of a triptych panel by the early Renaissance master Cimabue, and it represents the assumption of the Virgin. Other painters of the era painted similar compositions, with some showing both Christ and the Virgin seated on the same heavenly throne.

Here is Cimabue's work:



In reply to Liza's comment, even if an observer could identify the woman as the Mother of God, this image is still, erm, problematic from the Orthodox POV. The bodily assumption of the Mother of God after her death is accepted and mentioned, but not elaborated upon, in hymns and teachings. It is a mystery, and one which iconography has never portrayed, unlike non-Orthodox religious art.

What Orthodox iconography does show, and rightly so, is Christ mystically appearing at His Mother's dormition. He is surrounded by a mandorla of uncreated light in which are numerous seraphim, and He is holding the soul of His Mother, as a babe in swaddling-clothes. This beautifully and eloquently expresses the incomparable honor of the Virgin - as she gave birth and nurtured her Son and God, the Life of all, so He received her soul to escort it to heaven Himself, she being more honorable and more glorious than the hosts on high, as the hymn says. Allowing a "mere" angel to take her soul just would not do. The hymns of the Dormition must surely be the loveliest and most evocative of all the feasts of the Mother of God.

In Cimabue's painting, and its variants, while the Virgin is in a supplicatory posture, she is still seated at the same level as Christ. In iconographic deesis (supplicatory) panels which show Christ enthroned at the center, flanked by the Virgin and St John the Baptist (and others, in many cases), only Christ is enthroned. The Mother of God is indeed the most powerful of intercessors, but she is not, and never can be, equal to God. She was graced with divinity in the fullest sense, but she is not divine herself.




 

LBK

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Even if the stars were there, it wouldn't make this image acceptable as an icon. There is simply too much else wrong with it.
 

LBK

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Mor Ephrem said:
LBK said:
Even if the stars were there, it wouldn't make this image acceptable as an icon. There is simply too much else wrong with it.
Well, I like it.  I know you don't care.  :p  But I think it's a sweet image. 
My dear Mor, sentimentality and iconography don't mix.  ;)
 

LBK

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Mor Ephrem said:
Note that I deliberately avoided calling it an icon.  Don't I get brownie points at least for that?  :p
Glad you clarified.  :-*
 

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Mor Ephrem said:
Note that I deliberately avoided calling it an icon.  Don't I get brownie points at least for that?  :p
You'll have to content yourself with brownie points in two natures.
 

LizaSymonenko

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This icon isn't exactly "strange", however, I've never seen one like it.

What is the Mother of God holding?


 

LBK

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It looks like a chalice. Here is another version of it, which I find disturbing because of the Child's portrayal - in profile, and as a generic chubby babe, not as the all-knowing God before the Ages, as the kontakion of the Nativity proclaims:

 

LBK

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For those who can't see the image I posted, here's the same one from another site:

 

Mor Ephrem

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LBK said:
It looks like a chalice. Here is another version of it, which I find disturbing because of the Child's portrayal - in profile, and as a generic chubby babe, not as the all-knowing God before the Ages, as the kontakion of the Nativity proclaims:
Clearly, LBK, you're a little too judgmental on this one.  Our little Lord doesn't look like a generic chubby babe, those are cuter in real life.  This is clearly a sick baby being taken care of by our Lady, who doesn't seem to be able to get him to eat, take his medicine, etc.  Give him a chance to recover, geez.  ::)  :p 

Actually, they don't even look related.  If they looked like mother and son but he was a little more chubby, I wouldn't mind it so much (I know, my taste doesn't matter), but it bothers me that the child bears no resemblance to the mother.  I've never felt that way about an otherwise normal-looking icon before.  He looks like the Christological equivalent of Grumpy Cat.
 

LBK

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Mor Ephrem said:
LBK said:
It looks like a chalice. Here is another version of it, which I find disturbing because of the Child's portrayal - in profile, and as a generic chubby babe, not as the all-knowing God before the Ages, as the kontakion of the Nativity proclaims:
Clearly, LBK, you're a little too judgmental on this one.  Our little Lord doesn't look like a generic chubby babe, those are cuter in real life.  This is clearly a sick baby being taken care of by our Lady, who doesn't seem to be able to get him to eat, take his medicine, etc.  Give him a chance to recover, geez.   ::)  :p  

Actually, they don't even look related.  If they looked like mother and son but he was a little more chubby, I wouldn't mind it so much (I know, my taste doesn't matter), but it bothers me that the child bears no resemblance to the mother.  I've never felt that way about an otherwise normal-looking icon before.  He looks like the Christological equivalent of Grumpy Cat.
:laugh: :laugh:

You might be onto something here, Mor. Looking more closely, that baby does look sick. Like he's about to puke.  :p ;)
 

LizaSymonenko

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Here's one more.  I realize the Mother of God is often referred to as the "Ladder" between Heaven and Earth, however, I've never seen her holding a ladder.


 

LBK

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LizaSymonenko said:
Here's one more.  I realize the Mother of God is often referred to as the "Ladder" between Heaven and Earth, however, I've never seen her holding a ladder.

That's a mix of The Uncut Mountain, but The Unburnt Bush.  Odd.
 

LizaSymonenko

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Lol!  That explanation did little to help. Now I am seeing the use of a ladder to climb the mountain to reach the burning bush.




 
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