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Trans 'Woman' Demolishes World Records; Olympian Decries

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Sethrak

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Trans 'Woman' Demolishes World Records; Olympian Decries 'Pointless, Unfair Playing Field'


Male weightlifter Mary Gregory sets records in women's weightlifting. Instagram screenshot.
On Sunday, a biological man who identifies as a woman took the Masters world records for women's squat, women's bench press, and women's deadlift. A female Olympian responded by condemning the "pointless, unfair playing field" where biological women are beaten by biological men who identify as transgender women.

https://pjmedia.com/trending/trans-woman-sets-world-records-olympian-decries-pointless-unfair-playing-field/


 

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That is just disgusting. I cannot think of any other word to use.
 

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I wonder why we don't see trans 'men' wanting to participate in UFC fights.
 

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LOL. Sethrak appears to have an obsession.
 

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Sethrak said:
LOL Agabus appears ```
Speak of the devil and here he is, ha ha!
 

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This disproves the lie that men and women are equal.  Feminists tried to say that there is no difference, but if this continues, it will spell the end of women in sports. If this isn't stopped, only biological males will win Olympic medals?
 

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CarolS said:
This disproves the lie that men and women are equal.  Feminists tried to say that there is no difference, but if this continues, it will spell the end of women in sports. If this isn't stopped, only biological males will win Olympic medals?
Not so long ago, there were those who feared that, if black people took up more sports, only they would win medals. ::)

Gender desegregation in sport is not a recent debate issue. In most sports, actually, net physical attributes matter a lot less than mental and (in team sports) social ones, and with advancing sport technology, what you're born with will probably matter even less in future.
 

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CarolS said:
This disproves the lie that men and women are equal.  Feminists tried to say that there is no difference, but if this continues, it will spell the end of women in sports. If this isn't stopped, only biological males will win Olympic medals?

You are right sister ~ Men are superior in strength ~ Women are far superior in so many other thing ~ Gods design to make human life worth living ```
 

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This is far different ~ and you know it ~ allowing men to compete in strength and speed against girls under the pretext of ~ Akch you know what this is ~ you stand on the other side ~ because you are on the other side ```
 

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CarolS said:
This disproves the lie that men and women are equal.  Feminists tried to say that there is no difference, but if this continues, it will spell the end of women in sports. If this isn't stopped, only biological males will win Olympic medals?
Only transgender people will exist! Soon, everybody will be transgender. Equality can never exist in anything, much less sports!!!!11

Jackie Joyner-Kersee, Billie Jean King, Shirley Muldowney, Serena Williams, Venus Williams, Diana Nyad, all women in the history of the Olympics - do these names not mean anything to you?

Really, there are not many transgender people in the world. To spend all your time thinking that SOMEBODY WANTS TO FORCE ME TO HAVE A SEX CHANGE!!!, makes you look ridiculous.

I guess I shouldn't have ever voted or gone to university. Oops.
 

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Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?

Yet another thread in which the OP takes on issues of gender and sexuality without even as much as feigning basic Christian decency. Enough.
 

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I have two trans-gender friends. But this is still disgusting by any normal person's standards, let alone Christian morality. I am going to have to disagree with you here, ARAM.
 

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Arachne said:
CarolS said:
This disproves the lie that men and women are equal.  Feminists tried to say that there is no difference, but if this continues, it will spell the end of women in sports. If this isn't stopped, only biological males will win Olympic medals?
Not so long ago, there were those who feared that, if black people took up more sports, only they would win medals. ::)

Gender desegregation in sport is not a recent debate issue. In most sports, actually, net physical attributes matter a lot less than mental and (in team sports) social ones, and with advancing sport technology, what you're born with will probably matter even less in future.
''Advancing sport technology'' cannot overcome biological diferences between men and women like bone structure and muscular mass (unless we enter in some transhumanist era of extreme body modification and enhancement via exoskeletons or smth like that). Why not accepting the obvious differences between sexes? That's how God made us.


Team sports still depend a lot of physical aptitudes, the mental part is important, however, being mentally advanced wont make your legs stronger or more agile to kick a ball with more precision and speed, it wont make your body stronger to withhold a rugby match without ending in a intensive care hospital unit. 
 

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Aram said:
Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?

Yet another thread in which the OP takes on issues of gender and sexuality without even as much as feigning basic Christian decency. Enough.
How many of the Church Fathers had "basic Christian decency" by your standards?

Honestly I cannot imagine anything but pure horror and disgust from the saints of old looking on from Heaven into our world now.  Try imagining any single bishop at any of the Councils, and imagine telling them about the "gender spectrum" and other such demonic concepts. I can't conceive of any of them taking the idea well, possibly adorned with an immediate prostration and a few dozen "Kyrie eleison"s.

Just because I am against transgenderism does not mean I want to see them beat up or arrested or bullied or whatever. I don't want to see anyone suffer. Suffering is a fact of our fallen world tainted by the Fall. I want to, I need to, see them repent and come to Christ. And I've already seen that happen, for the better.

 

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reclusivus said:
Aram said:
Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?

Yet another thread in which the OP takes on issues of gender and sexuality without even as much as feigning basic Christian decency. Enough.
How many of the Church Fathers had "basic Christian decency" by your standards?

Honestly I cannot imagine anything but pure horror and disgust from the saints of old looking on from Heaven into our world now.  Try imagining any single bishop at any of the Councils, and imagine telling them about the "gender spectrum" and other such demonic concepts. I can't conceive of any of them taking the idea well, possibly adorned with an immediate prostration and a few dozen "Kyrie eleison"s.

Just because I am against transgenderism does not mean I want to see them beat up or arrested or bullied or whatever. I don't want to see anyone suffer. Suffering is a fact of our fallen world tainted by the Fall. I want to, I need to, see them repent and come to Christ. And I've already seen that happen, for the better.
Human decency means treating people with basic respect. Even if you think you disagree with their gender identity.
 

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Aram said:
reclusivus said:
Aram said:
Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?

Yet another thread in which the OP takes on issues of gender and sexuality without even as much as feigning basic Christian decency. Enough.
How many of the Church Fathers had "basic Christian decency" by your standards?

Honestly I cannot imagine anything but pure horror and disgust from the saints of old looking on from Heaven into our world now.  Try imagining any single bishop at any of the Councils, and imagine telling them about the "gender spectrum" and other such demonic concepts. I can't conceive of any of them taking the idea well, possibly adorned with an immediate prostration and a few dozen "Kyrie eleison"s.

Just because I am against transgenderism does not mean I want to see them beat up or arrested or bullied or whatever. I don't want to see anyone suffer. Suffering is a fact of our fallen world tainted by the Fall. I want to, I need to, see them repent and come to Christ. And I've already seen that happen, for the better.
Human decency means treating people with basic respect. Even if you think you disagree with their gender identity.
I wrote a long rant but scrapped it because it wasn't even worth it.

I do not disagree with a man's gender identity, because it's a delusion before the first place. It's a sickness and a disease and the Church is the hospital for it.

I spent years on tumblr. I have seen the most radical insanity, and all the obscure terminology for identities that never really rose to prominence, and then some enough for several lifetimes. The fringe leaks into the mainstream.

The road to Hell is paved with good intentions. I try and fail to have Christlike agape for everyone, but until my last breath I will never enable transgender illness. I personally know 2 LGBT who were very far from Christianity but came to Orthodoxy and abandoned their former slavery to their passions.

With all possible reverence and love, I need to simply tell you that you are out of your depth. Please treat my words here like every letter is printed in platinum. And pray for me.
 

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reclusivus said:
Aram said:
reclusivus said:
Aram said:
Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?

Yet another thread in which the OP takes on issues of gender and sexuality without even as much as feigning basic Christian decency. Enough.
How many of the Church Fathers had "basic Christian decency" by your standards?

Honestly I cannot imagine anything but pure horror and disgust from the saints of old looking on from Heaven into our world now.  Try imagining any single bishop at any of the Councils, and imagine telling them about the "gender spectrum" and other such demonic concepts. I can't conceive of any of them taking the idea well, possibly adorned with an immediate prostration and a few dozen "Kyrie eleison"s.

Just because I am against transgenderism does not mean I want to see them beat up or arrested or bullied or whatever. I don't want to see anyone suffer. Suffering is a fact of our fallen world tainted by the Fall. I want to, I need to, see them repent and come to Christ. And I've already seen that happen, for the better.
Human decency means treating people with basic respect. Even if you think you disagree with their gender identity.
I wrote a long rant but scrapped it because it wasn't even worth it.

I do not disagree with a man's gender identity, because it's a delusion before the first place. It's a sickness and a disease and the Church is the hospital for it.

I spent years on tumblr. I have seen the most radical insanity, and all the obscure terminology for identities that never really rose to prominence, and then some enough for several lifetimes. The fringe leaks into the mainstream.

The road to Hell is paved with good intentions. I try and fail to have Christlike agape for everyone, but until my last breath I will never enable transgender illness. I personally know 2 LGBT who were very far from Christianity but came to Orthodoxy and abandoned their former slavery to their passions.
When I ask that people treat LGBTQ+ folks with respect, I'm not speaking to you. Thanks for a thoughtful reply, even if I profoundly disagree with its premise.

With all possible reverence and love, I need to simply tell you that you are out of your depth. Please treat my words here like every letter is printed in platinum.
With that said, I'm not sure what this means. But thanks.
 

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Aram said:
Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?
I haven't been assailing this transgender weightlifter; this is my first post in the thread. But I did know a transgender woman and follow her progress from transition to after transition. Perhaps her life choices should alert us to the fact that transgenderism is a many-faceted phenomenon that is difficult to either support or oppose 100% in the abstract.

When I first met this individual he was a male student of (Lutheran) theology and editor of the theology student's journal at his university. But I met him at a Quaker gathering which he dropped in on looking for support he was not receiving from his own congregation.

The Quaker group gave support, friendship, and semi-official approval of his already ongoing transition though only after it was completed did he inform a few that he had been married at the time. During transitioning and living as a female, she dropped out of the theology faculty and began training as an executive secretary. She continued to be active with the Quakers.

After completing secretarial education, she decided that more money could be made in another profession and asked Quakers for approval to begin work as a prostitute. This was given by some but opposed by others, after which she disappeared from Quakers.

Some time later I found through articles written about her and a television report that she was specializing in selling sex to disabled men, many of whom had no other opportunity to bed a woman. For a time she also served as the head of the national advocacy group of prostitutes.

Needless to say, having known him-->her has coloured my view of transgenderism and the steps some will take to change gender. As I noted in the first paragraph, transgenderism is not a black or white  phenomenon that can be either celebrated or condemned outright. Each transgender person and their individual journey must be viewed individually. Suffice it to say that I lost contact with this individual when she left Quakers and have made no attempt to get back in touch with her.
 

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juliogb said:
Arachne said:
CarolS said:
This disproves the lie that men and women are equal.  Feminists tried to say that there is no difference, but if this continues, it will spell the end of women in sports. If this isn't stopped, only biological males will win Olympic medals?
Not so long ago, there were those who feared that, if black people took up more sports, only they would win medals. ::)

Gender desegregation in sport is not a recent debate issue. In most sports, actually, net physical attributes matter a lot less than mental and (in team sports) social ones, and with advancing sport technology, what you're born with will probably matter even less in future.
''Advancing sport technology'' cannot overcome biological diferences between men and women like bone structure and muscular mass (unless we enter in some transhumanist era of extreme body modification and enhancement via exoskeletons or smth like that). Why not accepting the obvious differences between sexes? That's how God made us.
Technology doesn't need to do any of that. It doesn't do it within sexes, and it won't do it across the divide. The 'athlete performs exceptionally despite not being gifted in the [insert desirable physical attribute] department' is almost as common as the 'athlete performs exceptionally because gifted in the same department'. And the vast majority of athletes are not exceptional in either respect. In a desegregated league, plenty of male athletes would find themselves outdone by female athletes (and that's the male athlete's worst nightmare, but that's another story).

juliogb said:
Team sports still depend a lot of physical aptitudes, the mental part is important, however, being mentally advanced wont make your legs stronger or more agile to kick a ball with more precision and speed, it wont make your body stronger to withhold a rugby match without ending in a intensive care hospital unit.
Precision kicking is a matter of limb-eye coordination, which is primarily a mental attribute and does not favour men or women. And all the brute strength in the world will do nothing against an opponent too fast and/or agile to be caught or hit.
 

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Aram said:
Honest question: Has anyone assailing this woman ever actually known a transgender person? Or is this just some kind of abstract and politicized clickbait at the expense of another person's basic humanity?
Yes, I have, I was actually friends with one, including while "he became she" and we only stopped talking because she became reclusive. Still, she has a natural bodily advantage compared to the average cis woman, making it an unfair game. This is obvious. Equality in "purity" is what makes doping illegal (even caffeine in some standards!), so why should an entire bodily formation be irrelevant?

So, my former friend would most probably disagree with me since it speaks against one of the most important points of her life, which is that someone can be born a man and then become just like another woman. But there is their soft spot on one hand and fairness of sports on the other. We're not talking about using the name of your choice here.
 

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First off, we have to remember that "gender" is grammatical. Words have gender, not people. People have biological sex. We have gotten so used to misusing the English language that it has enabled this whole abuse to develop in the first place. There are TWO biological sexes. There are USUALLY three grammatical genders, sometimes more, depending on language. English has three. Masculine, feminine, and neuter. Spanish has two, masculine and feminine. Latin and German each have three, masculine, feminine, and neuter.

People are either male or female. Very rarely you will find an intersex person, in which case the medical profession must often but not always make a choice at birth, sometimes later. But the VAST majority of people are male or female. A man has a penis and testes, a woman has a vagina and breasts. It really is that simple. I can NEVER become a woman. I can dress like one. I can be surgically altered to LOOK like one. But I can never get pregnant or have a period.

Remember: Words have gender. PEOPLE HAVE SEX. That's it, that's all, END OF STORY. Anything else you are told is complete nonsense.
 

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Diego said:
Remember: Words have gender. PEOPLE HAVE SEX. That's it, that's all, END OF STORY. Anything else you are told is complete nonsense.
And yet, people will gripe about 'gender roles', not 'sex roles'.

We are more than our biology.
 

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Arachne said:
Diego said:
Remember: Words have gender. PEOPLE HAVE SEX. That's it, that's all, END OF STORY. Anything else you are told is complete nonsense.
And yet, people will gripe about 'gender roles', not 'sex roles'.

We are more than our biology.
They are misusing words. "Gender" does not apply to people.
 

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Gender applies to any system of classification, I don't really see your point here. When it's used for people it's just because humans are primarily classified as either men or women.
 

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Diego said:
Arachne said:
Diego said:
Remember: Words have gender. PEOPLE HAVE SEX. That's it, that's all, END OF STORY. Anything else you are told is complete nonsense.
And yet, people will gripe about 'gender roles', not 'sex roles'.

We are more than our biology.
They are misusing words. "Gender" does not apply to people.
It has, for some 75 years; quite broadly for the last 40-odd ones, and it has long been adopted by the WHO and other medical organisations. Language evolves, get over it.
 

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Just because language is commonly misused, even by world institutions, does not mean that we should participate in that misuse. All that does is perpetuate stupidity. We need to hit the breaks on such use as quickly as possible, and insist on correct linguistics.
 

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Diego said:
Just because language is commonly misused, even by world institutions, does not mean that we should participate in that misuse. All that does is perpetuate stupidity. We need to hit the breaks on such use as quickly as possible, and insist on correct linguistics.
That's not how language works. (You misused 'linguistics', by the way.)
 

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Arachne said:
Diego said:
Just because language is commonly misused, even by world institutions, does not mean that we should participate in that misuse. All that does is perpetuate stupidity. We need to hit the breaks on such use as quickly as possible, and insist on correct linguistics.
That's not how language works. (You misused 'linguistics', by the way.)
I don't think I misused it, but I did use it in an unusual sense. Anyway, language does and can work that way, if it is guarded by purests, like the French language is, for example. English is one of the few languages that isn't, and it probably should be.
 

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We don't just accept how language evolves. Although I don't agree with Diego's beef with the word "gender" as used here, he has a point. Words carry many layers of meaning and sometimes language change has other underlying changes that are resistible as long as the older version is understandable.

For instance, the Portuguese word "judiar" ("to mistreat") has an obscure anti-Semitic etymology ("to treat like a Jew"). But the meaning is so old and deep-rooted that nobody realises any anti-Semitic connotation. The n-word, on the other hand, brings a very fresh remembrance of how black people were treated, so it can be easily exchanged for synonyms.
 

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RaphaCam said:
We don't just accept how language evolves. Although I don't agree with Diego's beef with the word "gender" as used here, he has a point. Words carry many layers of meaning and sometimes language change has other underlying changes that are resistible as long as the older version is understandable.

For instance, the Portuguese word "judiar" ("to mistreat") has an obscure anti-Semitic etymology ("to treat like a Jew"). But the meaning is so old and deep-rooted that nobody realises any anti-Semitic connotation. The n-word, on the other hand, brings a very fresh remembrance of how black people were treated, so it can be easily exchanged for synonyms.
I bet the few Portuguese-speaking Jews recognise it. They never forget ANYTHING. And after ten years in a synagogue, I have met Jews I liked, Jews I did not like, rich Jews, poor Jews, every kind of Jew, but I NEVER met one who was a fool.

And the Spanish word for Jew is judio. The minute I saw the word I knew it had something to do with Jews, and that was before I read your definition.
 

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And have you noticed how the n-word only brings up those connotations if a White person uses it? A Black person can shout it from the rooftops. Another aspect of the cheap unexplainable garbage that is political correctness.
 

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I've actually never seen anyone complain about it, and believe me, there aren't only a few Portuguese-speaking Jews. I know many, and the ones I don't know are vocal.

But it was just an example of how a word can lose its original connotations if it's old enough.
 

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Diego said:
And have you noticed how the n-word only brings up those connotations if a White person uses it? A Black person can shout it from the rooftops. Another aspect of the cheap unexplainable garbage that is political correctness.
It's a dumb word.

Says a lot about you if you miss it.
 

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RaphaCam said:
I've actually never seen anyone complain about it, and believe me, there aren't only a few Portuguese-speaking Jews. I know many, and the ones I don't know are vocal.

But it was just an example of how a word can lose its original connotations if it's old enough.
Your point is well taken, though.
 

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biro said:
Diego said:
And have you noticed how the n-word only brings up those connotations if a White person uses it? A Black person can shout it from the rooftops. Another aspect of the cheap unexplainable garbage that is political correctness.
It's a dumb word.

Says a lot about you if you miss it.
Look, I used the word once when I was a child and my mother slapped the crap out of me. I have never used it since. I don't approve of it. But, let's be honest, it is bizarre that if one group uses a word, its awful, but if another group uses the same word, its perfectly fine.
 

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Diego said:
Arachne said:
Diego said:
Just because language is commonly misused, even by world institutions, does not mean that we should participate in that misuse. All that does is perpetuate stupidity. We need to hit the breaks on such use as quickly as possible, and insist on correct linguistics.
That's not how language works. (You misused 'linguistics', by the way.)
I don't think I misused it, but I did use it in an unusual sense. Anyway, language does and can work that way, if it is guarded by purests, like the French language is, for example. English is one of the few languages that isn't, and it probably should be.
The Académie Française can dig its heels, but it can't stop the language changing, because society changes and language needs to reflect the changes. First comes the thing, and then the word that describes the thing. When the thing is no more, the word falls into disuse as well, unless it has been modified to cover more than its original meaning. That's why slang is outdated as swiftly as fashion, while other terms stick.

In the particular case we're looking at here, the only case where 'gender' is misused is when it is used interchangeably with 'sex'. The two are not synonyms. Gender is the psycho-social framework that defines and determines masculinity and femininity, of which sex (the biological components) is a subset.
 
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