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Vassula Ryden Excommunicated

Alveus Lacuna

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Fr. Anastasios said:
I'm not surprised that there was a concelebrated Orthodox-Roman Catholic liturgy; I was present at one such myself in 1999 (naturally, the Orthodox priest was acting in disobedience).  People do all sorts of crazy things in this modern age of relativism. Nothing shocks me anymore.
Was this when you were an Byzantine Catholic? If so, what jurisdiction was the Orthodox priest from?
 

Anastasios

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Alveus Lacuna said:
Fr. Anastasios said:
I'm not surprised that there was a concelebrated Orthodox-Roman Catholic liturgy; I was present at one such myself in 1999 (naturally, the Orthodox priest was acting in disobedience).  People do all sorts of crazy things in this modern age of relativism. Nothing shocks me anymore.
Was this when you were an Byzantine Catholic? If so, what jurisdiction was the Orthodox priest from?
Yes, I was a Byzantine Catholic, but I am not going to say anything identifying about the Orthodox priest because that was 11 years ago.
 

Irish Hermit

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"Not only was Rev. Fr. Daniel Crecan inspired to ask Vassula to speak to his congregation after the Divine Liturgy on the great feast of Pentecost Sunday, but he also invited us all to partake in the Eucharist. What a wonderful gift we were given by the Holy Spirit!

Fr. Daniel, the parish priest of this church shares his perspective on the events of this wonderful day:

"On the day of Pentecost was the feast day for our church and many people came to attend the Holy Liturgy. That day in our community we received many special guests who came from many parts of the world: one Greek born in Egypt, one from Switzerland, and one from the Philippines. That was wonderful and very special for us because we had never before had so many nationalities in our church. It does not matter if our Orthodox community is small, but it is our joy to minister together with believers from other countries and different churches. The Swiss man is my good friend and brother in Christ, a Roman-Catholic priest. On that special day drawn by the Spirit we shared together the same Holy Eucharist, the Holy Body and Blood of Christ. It was great, wonderful, divine ... .just like the teachings of our Saviour Christ, "MAY THEY ALL BE ONE!". Communion in the Eucharist is the sign of unity in the Holy Spirit. It was definitely a divine sign given by the Holy Spirit, of full communion in the love of Jesus Christ. But this is not all....we had a lot of people who came to receive the Holy Eucharist, singing, praying together and giving glory to our God. The presence of many Greek-Catholics sharing communion with us in the same church and sharing the Liturgy was indeed another sign of the presence of the Holy Spirit in the middle of our community. No words can ever tell the joy of what it is like to have full communion in truth, in unity with the Holy Spirit."


Vassula Ryden


That day, Fr. Daniel gave the Eucharist to Roman Catholics,
to Vassula & Greek Catholics Dan, his family, and friends


These people are NOT being given communion at the Liturgy.  Fr Daniel is half undressed and not wearing any Phelonion.  What is really happening here?

To see more pictures
http://tlig.org/en/news/2010-09-16/2129/
 

stashko

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Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....But orthodoxy Should Know better especally the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
 

stashko

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Continnued.....If this is the Way canonical Orthodoxy is coming too God Help Us . The Breakaway Orthodox Groups are starting to look more more Legitimate in my eyes......
 

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stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective. 

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especally the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
 

stashko

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Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective.  

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especally the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
 

PeterTheAleut

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stashko said:
Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective.  

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especally the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
And we don't do the same thing?
 

Irish Hermit

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Irish Hermit said:

That day, Fr. Daniel gave the Eucharist to Roman Catholics,
to Vassula & Greek Catholics Dan, his family, and friends


more pictures
http://tlig.org/en/news/2010-09-16/2129/
I noticed that Ryden seems to consider herself (above) not as an Orthodox Christian but as a Roman Catholic.  This is from her official wensite.
 

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ialmisry said:
Orest said:
augustin717 said:
How many Orientals are there in Romania?
A handful of Armenians.
True now there are just a handful of Aremnians left in present day Romania, but when Moldovia was part of Turkey the Aremnians played an important role in business - importing goods.  Even when Bukovyna was part of the Austrian Empire after 1775.  Suchava was once a significant city before the capital of Bukovyna was moved to Chernivsti by the Austrians.  Both cities had a population of Armenians with their own richly deocorated churches and of course schools right up until WW1.
The national poet of Romania, Mihai Eminescu, born Eminovich, is suspected of Armenian descent. Or even Turkish  :eek:. His last name is ultimately Arabic  :eek: :eek: :eek:
I thought it was Serbian :)
 

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Michał Kalina said:
No sources. I don't believe it at all.
healthy skepticism is good but simply dismissing a news report which is linked to its source:
http://tlig.org/en/news/2010-09-16/2129/
which is a Vassula Ryden blog.
Scroll down to the section regarding this incident titled:
Sunday, May 23 Pentecost Sunday Divine Liturgy in Bocsa Mantana Parish
Being generally dismissive is not healthy but is simply a sign of refusing to think critically about a troubling or complex issue.
But of course some people prefer the cave.
stashko said:
Continnued.....If this is the Way canonical Orthodoxy is coming too God Help Us . The Breakaway Orthodox Groups are starting to look more more Legitimate in my eyes......
That is why it so hard to be a thoughtful and informed Orthodox Christian within any of the Patriarchates now. Six years ago I was of the mind that the progressive Ecumenism was going down and that we would finally see a return to Tradition and to Orthodoxy as the Unique True Faith. Now however, I see that in spite of a rise of concern for ecumenism as heresy and devotion to Tradition on the part of many lay people and some clergy that most "canonical" bishops either do not care and will never try to prosecute the openly Ecumenist clergy in their ranks. When the "canonical" bishops are simply watching as millions of the faithful follow the heresy of Ecumenism and fall into Hell than I can't help but be shaken. I know of only a small minority of truly great bishops and monks within "canonical" Orthodox jurisdictions and I know that throughout most of the history of the Church only a minority of bishops have been great defenders of the faith but in these terrible times when we are faced with the greatest of heresies, Ecumenism, as it combines so many other heresies, you cannot simply stand-by and watch from a neutral standpoint. All bishops who are truly Orthodox must unite to prosecute the Ecumenists who are using our parishes and dioceses to lead as many people as they can into Hell.
When I feel this way how can I not sympathize with those who have broken away for the sake of the purity of our Orthodox faith. Those who've sown discord and caused the schisms were and are the heretics in the bosom of the Church.
 

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That is why it so hard to be a thoughtful and informed Orthodox Christian within any of the Patriarchates now. Six years ago I was of the mind that the progressive Ecumenism was going down and that we would finally see a return to Tradition and to Orthodoxy as the Unique True Faith. Now however, I see that in spite of a rise of concern for ecumenism as heresy and devotion to Tradition on the part of many lay people and some clergy that most "canonical" bishops either do not care and will never try to prosecute the openly Ecumenist clergy in their ranks. When the "canonical" bishops are simply watching as millions of the faithful follow the heresy of Ecumenism and fall into Hell than I can't help but be shaken. I know of only a small minority of truly great bishops and monks within "canonical" Orthodox jurisdictions and I know that throughout most of the history of the Church only a minority of bishops have been great defenders of the faith but in these terrible times when we are faced with the greatest of heresies, Ecumenism, as it combines so many other heresies, you cannot simply stand-by and watch from a neutral standpoint. All bishops who are truly Orthodox must unite to prosecute the Ecumenists who are using our parishes and dioceses to lead as many people as they can into Hell.
When I feel this way how can I not sympathize with those who have broken away for the sake of the purity of our Orthodox faith. Those who've sown discord and caused the schisms were and are the heretics in the bosom of the Church.
"And he said unto them, Take heed what ye hear: with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you: and unto you that hear shall more be given."
St Mark Gospell, 4:24

Who are YOU to say who's going to heaven or hell? Don't you know that the judgement belongs to God, all praises to Him?
 

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Irish Hermit said:
These people are NOT being given communion at the Liturgy.  Fr Daniel is half undressed and not wearing any Phelonion.  What is really happening here?

To see more pictures
http://tlig.org/en/news/2010-09-16/2129/
It's pretty obvious there was a liturgy and they were communed from those pictures. Fr Daniel appears to have taken off his phelonion to give out communion for some reason.  Irrespective of why he would take off his phelonion, he is clearly shown concelebrating with a Roman Catholic priest, holding up Ryden's book in his Church, and then letting her give a talk. I hope corrective measures are taken to help Fr Daniel realize his mistake.
 

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How do you know he is Romanian Orthodox Fr. Daniel and not Romanian Catholic Fr. Peter? How do you know it it a Parish under Romanian Patriarchate, not a separate one group? Because Ryden wrote so?

To confirm the report there should be two autonomous relations. Ryden could have written anything on her blog and none from it have to be true.
 

Irish Hermit

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Michał Kalina said:
How do you know he is Romanian Orthodox Fr. Daniel and not Romanian Catholic Fr. Peter? How do you know it it a Parish under Romanian Patriarchate, not a separate one group? Because Ryden wrote so?

To confirm the report there should be two autonomous relations. Ryden could have written anything on her blog and none from it have to be true.
Fr Daniel Crecan is on facebook, if anybody would like to ask him questions...

http://www.facebook.com/REV.DR.DanielCrecan
 

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ma2000 said:
ialmisry said:
Orest said:
augustin717 said:
How many Orientals are there in Romania?
A handful of Armenians.
True now there are just a handful of Aremnians left in present day Romania, but when Moldovia was part of Turkey the Aremnians played an important role in business - importing goods.  Even when Bukovyna was part of the Austrian Empire after 1775.  Suchava was once a significant city before the capital of Bukovyna was moved to Chernivsti by the Austrians.  Both cities had a population of Armenians with their own richly deocorated churches and of course schools right up until WW1.
The national poet of Romania, Mihai Eminescu, born Eminovich, is suspected of Armenian descent. Or even Turkish  :eek:. His last name is ultimately Arabic  :eek: :eek: :eek:
I thought it was Serbian :)
Eminovich sounds like a bosnijan/serbian name......do Arabs have this typ of name also...Russians Have The vich at the end of there names as well...
 

Anastasios

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Irish Hermit said:
Michał Kalina said:
How do you know he is Romanian Orthodox Fr. Daniel and not Romanian Catholic Fr. Peter? How do you know it it a Parish under Romanian Patriarchate, not a separate one group? Because Ryden wrote so?

To confirm the report there should be two autonomous relations. Ryden could have written anything on her blog and none from it have to be true.
Fr Daniel Crecan is on facebook, if anybody would like to ask him questions...

http://www.facebook.com/REV.DR.DanielCrecan
I sent him a message last night, but he hasn't responded yet. I've talked to him a few times in the past.
 

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PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective.  

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especially the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
And we don't do the same thing?
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
 

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stashko said:
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
I think a bishop who performed an exoticism on an icon would probably be deposed. An exorcism, on the other hand, probably wouldn't be a problem.  ;)
 

PeterTheAleut

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stashko said:
PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective.  

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especially the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
And we don't do the same thing?
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
Is this what your church does?
 

stashko

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SubdeaconSL said:
stashko said:
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
I think a bishop who performed an exoticism on an icon would probably be deposed. An exorcism, on the other hand, probably wouldn't be a problem.  ;)
Im not talking about the Ikonas that are in churches , example if i had a icona at home that started to weep ,i would take it to church and have a Bishop examine thoroughly ,Im sure he wouldn't just accept it as a authentic miracle with out doing a exorcism on it......Because all iconas arn't purchased thur a church so they may not all be blessed.....
 

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stashko said:
SubdeaconSL said:
stashko said:
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
I think a bishop who performed an exoticism on an icon would probably be deposed. An exorcism, on the other hand, probably wouldn't be a problem.  ;)
Im not talking about the Ikonas that are in churches , example if i had a icona at home that started to weep ,i would take it to church and have a Bishop examine thoroughly ,Im sure he wouldn't just accept it as a authentic miracle with out doing a exorcism on it......Because all iconas arn't purchased thur a church so they may not all be blessed.....
Even Aunt Denise takes her images to the church to get them blessed...
 

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ialmisry said:
The national poet of Romania, Mihai Eminescu, born Eminovich, is suspected of Armenian descent. Or even Turkish  :eek:. His last name is ultimately Arabic  :eek: :eek: :eek:
I thought that his last name, or that of his father, was Eminovici, which was a slavic name, and Eminescu was the Romanian version of it? 
 

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Lenexa said:
When the "canonical" bishops are simply watching as millions of the faithful follow the heresy of Ecumenism and fall into Hell than I can't help but be shaken.
Why should millions of these faithful people fall into Hell, if it is not their fault, but they are being led by your Orthodox bishops and priests? Is it official that they will all be falling into Hell? This seems to be pretty strong to me to send millions of faithful Orthodox Christian people to everlasting fire and damnation  in Hell because they are listening to their Orthodox bishops on this issue?



Fixed quote tags...  Nothing more... -PtA
 

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If those millions only read their betters on the internet, how easely they would avoid ending up in hell ;)
 

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Perhaps making arguments using hyperbole is not as well understood as I thought it would be.
No one who really cares about the salvation of his brothers and sisters can simply stand by and let them be led astray. We all have the ability to help and influence people for better or worse.
Perhaps I should've said bishops should be helping lead millions to heaven and not just stand-by and hope they find the way on their own.
 

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Lenexa said:
Perhaps making arguments using hyperbole is not as well understood as I thought it would be.
No one who really cares about the salvation of his brothers and sisters can simply stand by and let them be led astray. We all have the ability to help and influence people for better or worse.
Perhaps I should've said bishops should be helping lead millions to heaven and not just stand-by and hope they find the way on their own.
:-\ Don't know... At least in Antiochian Patriarcate here in Rio de Janeiro it's very usual to see Orthodox priests giving communion to Roman Catholics.
Let me tell you all a story: Here in Rio, there is a church called "Paróquia Ortodoxa de Santo Expedito". He is the saint of urgent causes, and is not recognized by the Holy Catholic Church. But every sunday it is full (usually, if you don't arrive early, you'll be almost out of the church), and the people are generally catholics, but the priest (Padre Geraldo) gives eucharist to everybody there. Usually, they do not demand a chrism.
On the other hand, Catholics welcome Orthodox on their parishes, and also give them communion.
Of course both Catholics and Orthodox teach the believers to do not do so unless if leads them into mortal sin or in danger of death, but if you get there by your own legs, they do not let you outside.
Ad Majorem Gloriam Dei
 

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Irish Hermit said:
Irish Hermit said:

That day, Fr. Daniel gave the Eucharist to Roman Catholics,
to Vassula & Greek Catholics Dan, his family, and friends


more pictures
http://tlig.org/en/news/2010-09-16/2129/
I noticed that Ryden seems to consider herself (above) not as an Orthodox Christian but as a Roman Catholic.  This is from her official wensite.

Father,
I don't think the woman in that picture is Vassula.  I think this is Vassula (the blonde woman in black):



 

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augustin717 said:
If those millions only read their betters on the internet, how easely they would avoid ending up in hell ;)

You should listen to your own advice.  ;)
 

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PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective.  

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especially the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
And we don't do the same thing?
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
Is this what your church does?
The practice of the Russian and Serbian Churches too.
 

PeterTheAleut

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Irish Hermit said:
PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective.  

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especially the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
And we don't do the same thing?
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
Is this what your church does?
The practice of the Russian and Serbian Churches too.
You do realize I'm challenging stashko's stupid stereotypes? ;)
 

Irish Hermit

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PeterTheAleut said:
Irish Hermit said:
PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
PeterTheAleut said:
stashko said:
Salpy said:
stashko said:
Did't the Greek Orthodox church that excommunicated her talk to other Orthodox Churches and give them a HEADS UP, and tell them about her.....
Its Confusing this mess ....
I really do wish that an Orthodox source--EO or OO--would publish and circulate some sort of pamphlet or booklet to educate and warn people about her.  So far all we have are various documents that one can print out from the internet.  It's not quite as effective. 

I could understand Catholics loving and chasing after these type of visionaries ,They can't seem to get enough of them....
One of her greatest critics has been Pope Benedict.

But orthodoxy Should Know better especially the Orthodox Clergy....God help us when our Clergy start Falling for this and leading the Orthodox Faithful astray....
As I've said, her supporters can be deceptive and have actually been known to lie about clergy supporting her and her messages when no such thing has really happened.  I also think some clergy have been tricked into giving the appearance of supporting her when they didn't really know who she was.  I guess more needs to be done to educate not only lay persons about her, but also clergy.
Maybe the Pope Did or Didn't By Speaking Loud enough for His Faithful to Hear...Catholics do chase after these weird things ..Just here in Chicago At the Fullerton expressway  Exit, under the bridge someone  noticed a Smudge that he or she interpeted as the Image of the Virgin Mary...Created such a Traffic Jam due to the Catholic Faithful going there to venerate the smudge...That went on for quite a long time...
And we don't do the same thing?
No We don't If A Holy Ikona starts to weep even in a Private residence It's taken to the church ,so a Bishop  can examine it and do a exoticism on it to make sure its not of the devil....
Is this what your church does?
The practice of the Russian and Serbian Churches too.
You do realize I'm challenging stashko's stupid stereotypes? ;)
I've witnessed some of what Stashko speaks of..... a few years back somebody noticed that the fence post on a Sydney beach resembled the profile of the Holy Virgin.  Before you could say jiggery popery there were Catholics there by the hundreds and thousands, kneeling in the sand and saying the rosary, kissing the fence post....

I don't know whatever become of the post or how the story ended...
 
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Fr. Anastasios said:
Irish Hermit said:
These people are NOT being given communion at the Liturgy.  Fr Daniel is half undressed and not wearing any Phelonion.  What is really happening here?

To see more pictures
http://tlig.org/en/news/2010-09-16/2129/
It's pretty obvious there was a liturgy and they were communed from those pictures. Fr Daniel appears to have taken off his phelonion to give out communion for some reason.  Irrespective of why he would take off his phelonion, he is clearly shown concelebrating with a Roman Catholic priest, holding up Ryden's book in his Church, and then letting her give a talk. I hope corrective measures are taken to help Fr Daniel realize his mistake.


Father Anastasios,

Seeing as this priest is not vested, it doesn't look like he's concelebrating. While it's certainly inappropriate for him to be up at the altar, because it gives that impression, my guess for now is that there was no concelebration.

Simply from the photographic evidence. Fr. Daniel would probably be a better person to ask.

Furthermore, Fr. Daniel does not mention Fr. Rolf concelebrating. Her website does, however, mention this:

"On Monday morning, Fr. Rolf celebrated Holy Mass in the Foundation's beautiful chapel while Fr. Daniel celebrated the Divine Liturgy for the Feast of the Holy Trinity in his church. "

So the next day, they did not concelebrate, but celebrated Eucharist at their own churches. This of course doesn't shed much more light on what happened on Sunday.

Vassula Ryden asserted initially that they concelebrated. I think she must have been confused about what the term means.

Of course, there is always the possibility that Fr. Rolf has gone off the deep end and celebrated Mass in an alb and stole, without a chasuble.
 

ialmisry

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stanley123 said:
ialmisry said:
The national poet of Romania, Mihai Eminescu, born Eminovich, is suspected of Armenian descent. Or even Turkish  :eek:. His last name is ultimately Arabic  :eek: :eek: :eek:
I thought that his last name, or that of his father, was Eminovici, which was a slavic name, and Eminescu was the Romanian version of it? 
yes. Romanians having slavic names is quite common:there is a Romanian recension of Church Slavonic which was the official language for quite some time.
 

Anastasios

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Thanks for your comments, WetCatechumen. I've actually been at a Roman Catholic Mass where a priest "went off the deep end" and served a liturgy without a chausable....we've seen Fr. Daniel took off his phelonion to give out communion...then the fact that they are letting a total heretic like Ryden do *anything* in their churches...a lot of inconsistency in all of this.

I did ask Fr. Daniel what the story is, but he has not gotten back to me yet.

Fr Anastasios
 

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Having worked in a Roman Parish for a decade I can say that it is quite common to con-celebrate in just an alb and stole (at least in the parishes that I was familiar with), as they are all that are required.
 
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ICXCNIKA said:
Having worked in a Roman Parish for a decade I can say that it is quite common to celebrate in just an alb and stole, as they are all that are required.
That is not true. A chasuble is required unless there is a large number of celebrants. I have been to ordinations, and only about half of the priests wear chasubles. However, every other Mass I've been to, the priest has worn a chasuble, with the exception of a certain religious parish I attend which is noted for its many abuses. The priests there will sometimes wear a stole over their religious habit, which is an abuse.

A stolen quote from Redemptionis Sacramentum:

123.] "The vestment proper to the Priest celebrant at Mass, and in other sacred actions directly connected with Mass unless otherwise indicated, is the chasuble, worn over the alb and stole".213 Likewise the Priest, in putting on the chasuble according to the rubrics, is not to omit the stole. All Ordinaries should be vigilant in order that all usage to the contrary be eradicated.

[124.] A faculty is given in the Roman Missal for the Priest concelebrants at Mass other than the principal concelebrant (who should always put on a chasuble of the prescribed color), for a just reason such as a large number of concelebrants or a lack of vestments, to omit "the chasuble, using the stole over the alb".214 Where a need of this kind can be foreseen, however, provision should be made for it insofar as possible. Out of necessity the concelebrants other than the principal celebrant may even put on white chasubles. For the rest, the norms of the liturgical books are to be observed.
It's an abuse. Furthermore, priests who are at Mass but do not concelebrate will sometimes dress in this fashion licitly.
 
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Fr. Anastasios said:
Thanks for your comments, WetCatechumen. I've actually been at a Roman Catholic Mass where a priest "went off the deep end" and served a liturgy without a chausable....we've seen Fr. Daniel took off his phelonion to give out communion...then the fact that they are letting a total heretic like Ryden do *anything* in their churches...a lot of inconsistency in all of this.

I did ask Fr. Daniel what the story is, but he has not gotten back to me yet.

Fr Anastasios
I've been to those too, sadly. As you can see in my post above, it is an abuse. A parish run by Dominicans attached to my University often has daily mass where the priest will celebrate with only a stole over his habit. They do wear chasubles on Sunday, but they wear their stoles over their chasubles.

Yes, I agree that there is a lot of inconsistency. However, it is likely that Ryden doesn't know the difference between a priest standing near the altar while another priest celebrates and an actual concelebration. It would still be scandalous, however, for Fr. Daniel to allow Fr. Rolf behind the iconostasis. I choose to believe this until I see evidence to the contrary.
 

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An abuse in a Roman parish???! Of course I could have been confused by the jarring sounds of the Rock and Roll mass, The 20 girl altar servers etc.
 
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