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Why is "white pride" an inherently racist term?

jnorm888

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Acolyte said:
Why is there "black pride," "Asian pride," "Indian pride," "Latin pride," etc.? If "white pride" is intolerable, can we please stop the double-standard, and end every kind of racial pride? No racial group is inherently better than another.
I could be wrong, but I think it started in the 1960's. It was an over-reaction in the other direction of the western European Racism in America.

However, with that said. It must be made known that "black pride" isn't really about a "race". It's more about Africa. Since most black Americans don't have a single "country" that we can call our "motherland". We use the word "black" this and "black" that to refer to Africa in the same way that someone would use the word "greek" to refer to greece, or Polish to refer to Poland, or Russian to refer to Russia.


I no longer use the words "black pride". Just for the fact that I think the term is outdated and it doesn't really express the true intent of what Marcus Garvey, and others some decades later in the 1960's wanted to do.


I use the term "African pride" the sameway someone would use the term "Irish pride". Now why am I using a whole continant instead of a single country? Because most black Americans came from different tribes and regions in Western, and Central Africa.

So we can't say "Nigerian pride" when the country of Nigeria wasn't formed yet, plus alot of us don't come from Nigeria, but if we say "African pride" then we include all the places(countries, ....and regions) of where we came from.

Plus if you really want to be honest ...... then I would say that most black Americans are mixed anyway. Our western European slave owners went into the Barn and slepted with our women and so alot of us our redbone, light skin, brown and even some of us who are real dark still have some western European Ancestry. Many of us also have Native American and hispanic mixed in us as well. So we are pretty much a mixed people. But the two common streams in all of us is that we came from Africa, but now live in America. And so we call ourselves African American.


So this is the true intent of that term. But like I said......I think it's outdated, and that's why I no longer use it.


Now if you think it's still wrong for me to use the terms "African American", and "African pride", then I will just have to disagree with you. For I don't think they are racist or hatefull in any way. All it is is "veneration". I venerate my motherland the sameway an Irish American would venerate their motherland.

I love all because we all come from Adam, Eve, Noah and his sons, and I venerate Christ's teachings above all, and Christ wants us to love all humanity.







JNORM888
 

jnorm888

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Acolyte said:
There is a difference between selfishness and what Ayn Rand termed "rational self-interest," which is based on the philosophy of Aristotle. I've explained it previously on this forum. The world is in debt to Western civilization in how they've employed our inventions, our developments, to their benefit.
This is nothing more than Modern secular Scholasticism. Why should I care about what Ayn Rand says? Why should I care about a B.F. Skinner.....ect. If you are an Orthodox Christian then you should care about what the Orthodox tradition says.





JNORM888
 

jnorm888

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GabrieltheCelt said:
Αριστοκλής said:
Just so OzG doesn't think I always disagree with him  ;), this has to be one of the most ridiculous topics ever started here...ever. It is beneath comment or opinion other than that.
I'm inclined to agree with you, but I think maybe the more the issue of 'race' is discussed then maybe (hopefully?) it might do some good.  


Though I've come a looong way from where I was, I'm brave enough to admit that I still have racist tendencies at times.  I think if people are honest with themselves, they'd admit that, they too, might feel the same way.  I have friends in the Klan and friends who are not in the Klan but whom are still infatuated with their race; this so-called "White Pride".  I have distant relatives in the Klan, but even the majority who are not associated with the Klan (and even those who readily admit their disgust for such groups) are still a little racist at times.  But this transcends 'color', race, and ethnicity.  I'm sure many of us have heard the rediculous term 'reverse racism' which is used to describe blacks who hate whites.  In fact, just last semester, we were discussing terrorism in Pakistan.  I don't recall the specifics, but I do recall a black woman saying (about Pakistani's), "What's the difference; they all look the same."  That one really made me hoppin' mad but probably because I view Pakistani and Indian women as reeeally purty! :D   I hear that all the time from my friends.  If a black person is walking down the street, invariable someone will say, "What's Obama doing here?"

In America, and I suspect just about everywhere else, race (whatever that means) will always be an issue.  My friends all lament about the fact that here in America, you can have 'African American Heritage Month', 'Latino Heritage Month', 'American Indian Heritage Month', and so on but not 'Caucasion Heritage Month'.  I agree that that would be kinda goofy, but the point's not lost on thinking people.  We have a Black Entertainment Television network that really irks every other race here.  We have the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) that, to my way of thinking is outdated and racist.  Why don't we remove the word 'Colored' (a word that's fallen out of favor anyway) and just leave it at that?  The National Association for the Advancement of....People?  All y'all know that all hell would break loose if a National Association for the Advancement of White People was looked upon as favorable as the NAACP is.  And how about the issue of Barack Obama as another example.  I hear from a great many black people that they're voting for him solely on the basis of his skin color.  If that weren't dumb enough, they're completely overlooking the fact that he's Black and White!

But at the same time, I do believe that this notion of 'color blindness' is very unhealthy.  Everytime I hear someone say, "Oh, I don't see colors.  I'm sooo beyond that."  I just want to slap them and call BS because it is BS.  

Being from the area that I'm from, the superiority of whites over everyone else (especially over blacks) is not just a way of life- it's a fact.  Now I no longer ascribe to goofy ideas like that, but, if that's all you hear from your everyone from your Grandaddy on down to your neighborhood grocer, it takes a lot of thinking and energy to "rise above your raisin'" as we say.  On the days that I begin to think that the sun rises and sets on my race, all I have to do is look at my icon of our Lord and Savior Jesus the Christ.  Jewish and dark skinned?  Oh my, whatever will my Klan friends think!

I apologize if my honesty scandalized or hurt any of you, that wasn't my intention.  

In Christ,

Gabriel      

No need to apologize, I enjoyed your post. And thanks again for being honest. And I agree with you about a good number of black Americans only voting for Obama because of his skin color. And not because of his "policies". My own mother is voting for him just for that reason, but to put all of this in context, you have to understand that alot of black Americans still remember jim crow. My mother lived through it, so alot of the older black American population has an Axe to grind, and rightfully so.....for what they lived through. There is a reason for everything, and that is one of the reasons. I'm sure in time, a good number of the older population will look beyond skin color. I am a Republican and I am sticking with the red ticket. But it is hard when those around you are not.

But I agree with you that we have to outgrow the racist culture we were raised in. But that takes time. Time and understanding......not to mention alot of grace.





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Amdetsion

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Heorhij said:
Acolyte said:
Are you saying that being a Christian means having low self-esteem?
Yes, absolutely. All saints had extremely low self-esteem, always weeping about their own sinfulness and unworthiness. Stop doing it, and you are satan's easy prey.
I concur
 

Heorhij

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jnorm888 said:
Acolyte said:
There is a difference between selfishness and what Ayn Rand termed "rational self-interest," which is based on the philosophy of Aristotle. I've explained it previously on this forum. The world is in debt to Western civilization in how they've employed our inventions, our developments, to their benefit.
This is nothing more than Modern secular Scholasticism. Why should I care about what Ayn Rand says? Why should I care about a B.F. Skinner.....ect. If you are an Orthodox Christian then you should care about what the Orthodox tradition says.

JNORM888
Agree 100%. See also Colossians 2:8.
 

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Heorhij said:
jnorm888 said:
Acolyte said:
There is a difference between selfishness and what Ayn Rand termed "rational self-interest," which is based on the philosophy of Aristotle. I've explained it previously on this forum. The world is in debt to Western civilization in how they've employed our inventions, our developments, to their benefit.
This is nothing more than Modern secular Scholasticism. Why should I care about what Ayn Rand says? Why should I care about a B.F. Skinner.....ect. If you are an Orthodox Christian then you should care about what the Orthodox tradition says.

JNORM888
Agree 100%. See also Colossians 2:8.
I agree 100% as well.
 

Heorhij

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Rosehip said:
I agree, but still wonder about the paralyzing and crippling low self-esteem of the person who has been constantly abused as a child, for instance. Is this good? 
Perhaps not, if the low self-esteem is carried to its extreme. But still better than the opposite (high self-esteem).  

Rosehip said:
I've noticed in Orthodox thought Christians are seldom referred to as "children of God", and wondered why this is so? After all, aren't we His sons and daughters, and as such, very precious and of great worth?
Yes, I think you are right... However, in my Orthodox prayer book many prayers say about God that He is the "lover of the humankind" (in Ukrainian, "чоловіколюбeць" - probably a direct translation from the Greek "philanthropos"). And the first major evening prayer says, "Lord, have mercy on us... for You are our God, and we are Your people; we all are the work of Your hands."  
 

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As I said previously, I really don't like the idea of "white pride," since one shouldn't have pride in accomplishments that are not his own. 
 

Ebor

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Acolyte said:
Ebor said:
First, on what do you base your first premise, please?  
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1531296,00.html
Thank you.  That's a brief bit in a popular magazine.  I wonder what the author based *it* on.  :-\  Are there any other articles that you could think of?


May I ask what historical example you are thinking of here, please?  Thank you in advance.
I've already gave you a historical example, what the Turks did to my people for hundreds of years. While Turks might be genetically caucasian, they are culturally Islamic, and do not share a common history with Western civilization, aside from being an oppressor.
To be blunt why would this not be a cultural conflict as opposed to a 'racial/racist' one? 

The definition of what you think "white" is would seem to be a bit unclear.  For some a "race" is genetically defined. (for me there is only one "race" and that is the Human one.) 

And would you please give some guidelines for what you consider to be "Western Civilization"?  Thank you in advance.

Ebor
 
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